Dear All,
I apologise to those who found my remarks about tampons offensive. However, I was demonstrating (flippantly) my own ignorance as to what 'wings' on tampons are? as have seen them advertised that way. Similarly, some people do not seem to understand what I meant by wings on toilets, they are platforms on either side of the seat to people to sit on. It is interesting to note that some people wish to 'shy away' from this topic, it is important as we are talking about different cultural attitudes and if it means that I have to look into people different toilet habits to combat any inequalities then this debate is informative (although may be not conclusive!). This is no different to what I have to consider and report on daily, whether it be of high level national strategic importance or important to the needs of individual patients (students) I would treat it the same.
Kind regards,
Dipen
Dipen Rajyaguru LL.B (Hons)
Health Equality & Diversity Specialist
Barnet PCT
020 8937 7709
-----Original Message-----
From: HE Administrators equal opportunities list
[mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Chris Baxter
Sent: 25 September 2008 14:12
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Delicate Enquiry: please feel free to hit delete this email
is about toilets
Dear all
Informative maybe but somewhat inconclusive I feel.
Toilet seats are broken because:
Drug dealers stand on them in order to place drugs in loft spaces
People (whether they be students or staff) stand on them to perform
bodily functions
People (whether they be students or staff) stand on them to perform wudu
It is a student prank
It all looks like guess work to me, I am not aware of this problem,
around 23% of our students are international, I have no figures for
pranksters and drug dealers.
Regards
Chris Baxter
Diversity Officer
Student Services
-----Original Message-----
From: HE Administrators equal opportunities list
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Pamela Graham
Sent: 25 September 2008 10:54
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Delicate Enquiry
Hi all
As a colleague of Julie who asked the question in the first place, I
must support Abdul's reply. It also makes a change to have so many
informative emails in reponse to a query.
Pamela
-----Original Message-----
From: HE Administrators equal opportunities list
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Brook, Maz
Sent: 25 September 2008 10:48
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Delicate Enquiry
"How do you know some people didn't find Dipen's last email useful?"
Which reminds me - I do feel duty bound to point out that tampons don't
have wings.
:-)
Maz
PS - as an estates professional, I have found the discussion extremely
useful.
-----Original Message-----
From: HE Administrators equal opportunities list
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Abdul Wahab
Sent: 25 September 2008 09:58
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Delicate Enquiry
Anne,
Not all topics on Jiscmail are going to be of interest to everyone. I
certainly receive many emails through Jiscmail in which I have no
interest.
But discussions cannot be tailored to individual preferences. I don't
think it's up to any individual to decide whether a discussion has run
it's course.
How do you know some people didn't find Dipen's last email useful?
Regards
Abdul
-----Original Message-----
From: HE Administrators equal opportunities list
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Anne Mwangi
Sent: 24 September 2008 15:55
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Delicate Enquiry
Dear Colleagues, is it just me who thinks this discussion has run its
course...?
Regards
Anne
-----Original Message-----
From: HE Administrators equal opportunities list
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Rajyaguru Dipen
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 1:02 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Delicate Enquiry
In Asia and the far east, it is common practice to wash yourself with
running water. Therefore, it may be seen as culturally insensitive if
such facilities are not available. With regards to toilets, many people
around the world find using 'toilet paper' and sitting on 'used' seats
unhygenic and not environmentally friendly. The 'squatting ' method is
apparently the most efficient way to defecate. As student I lived in a
multicultural house and our toilet seat used to break as friends of mine
refused to 'sit' on the toilet and preferred to squat on the seat, these
seats were not designed for squatting. However, you can get toilets with
'wings' (rather like tampons!).
However, it may be worth noting the way we defecate sitting high upon a
seat is something that we have been forced (socialised) to do and
washing your backside with water is not only hygienic but
environmentally friendly. I hope this helps.
Kind regards,
Dipen
Dipen Rajyaguru LL.B (Hons)
Health Equality & Diversity Specialist
Barnet PCT
020 8937 7709
-----Original Message-----
From: HE Administrators equal opportunities list
[mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Abdul Wahab
Sent: 23 September 2008 15:08
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Delicate Enquiry
That is what the original email seemed to suggest.
In Asia both types of toilets are available. A lot of people
have a Western style toilet fitted to accommodate the needs of friends
and relatives from abroad. So it wouldn't be too much to ask if we did
the same. The hygiene issue is definitely true as having spoken to
relatives they find it inconcievable that everyone is going to use the
same seat. But I think it's pointless making suggestions without knowing
what students actually want.
-----Original Message-----
From: HE Administrators equal opportunities list
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Deborah Viney
Sent: 23 September 2008 14:45
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Delicate Enquiry
some people believe that people who are used to
squatting style toilets may stand on the seat and then squat -
personally I doubt it, but I have heard it suggested.
It does make me think of another point though: I can
imagine that those used to "squatters" might feel that western style
toilets are unhygienic because you have to touch them, so it may be
worth ensuring that seat cleaning spray and seat covers are made
available.
regards, Deb
2008/9/23 Abdul Wahab <[log in to unmask]>
I'm confused about that too. The only way the
seat would get broken is if
someone had stood on it (possibly to hide their
drugs!). Unless students are
maliciously breaking toilet seats.
-----Original Message-----
From: HE Administrators equal opportunities list
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
Adam Jones
Sent: 23 September 2008 14:16
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Delicate Enquiry
Hello,
Regarding the provision of ablution facilities
for Muslim students and staff,
I'm wondering about the connection with damage
to toilet seats.
Surely it would not be permissible to perform
wudu with water from the
toilet? Nor would it be permissible to bring a
container of water into the
cubicle.
Anyway, surely neither case would require
standing on the toilet seat?
Best wishes
Adam
------------------------------------------------
Adam Jones
Equality & Diversity
Newcastle University
e: [log in to unmask]
t: +44 (0)191 222 8794
http://www.ncl.ac.uk/diversity
>-----Original Message-----
>From: HE Administrators equal opportunities
list
>[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of K
HAYAT
>Sent: 23 September 2008 11:02
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: Delicate Enquiry
>
>Hello Colleagues,
>
>You may wish to look at providing proper
Ablution facilities for Muslim
>students and staff. It sounds like people are
using the current
>toilets for washing and cleaning which is a key
requirement for Muslims
>before they pray. Ramadan began in September
and most Muslims are
>fasting until the end of September/Early
October. Whilst fasting is
>taking place there is generally an increase in
Prayers and this is why
>you are finding that the toilets are being used
the way they are.
>
>The solution would be to provide adequate
ablution facilities, I know
>other organisations who have made such
requirements available. Further
>advice could be sought from Muslim
students/staff on what the
>requirements are.
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>Kez Hayat
>Equality and Diversity Officer
>University of Bradford
>Tel: 01274 233076
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: HE Administrators equal opportunities
list
>[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
Julie Bullimore
>Sent: 23 September 2008 09:44
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Delicate Enquiry
>
>Dear Colleagues,
>
>It's interesting the queries that come your way
when you work in E&D.
>This is one I need to share but it is on a
delicate subject so those of
>a less robust nature, please look away now.
>
>Last year we had to replace a huge number of
toilet seats in one
>particular faculty. Over the summer all has
been quiet, but last week,
>it started again. We believe the seats are
being broken because of
>people standing on them when going to the
toilet. Now I understand that
>the most likely explanation for this is that
some of our overseas
>students will be used to a different type of
toilet and find it
>difficult to use a western toilet.
>
>I'm sure that we can do simple things like put
signs up asking people
>not to do it but my question is - have any of
you come across this
>problem and have you made any adjustments such
as changing some of your
>facilities to be more accommodating? I.e..
installing Asian or hole in
>the floor toilets? Or perhaps some other novel
way of dealing with the
>issue.
>
>Any advice much appreciated.
>
>Julie
>
>Julie Bullimore
>Equality and Diversity Adviser
>Newcastle University
>[log in to unmask]
>0191 222 3440
>
--
Deb Viney, Diversity Advisor, SOAS
---------------------------------------------------------
Bloomsbury Diversity Week is 10th - 15th Nov 2008. If
you fancy joining the fabulous SOAS World Music Choir for an afternoon
on Monday 10th Nov, please contact [log in to unmask] for a registration
form.
---------------------------------------------------------
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0XG tel: 0207
898 4957 email: [log in to unmask]
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