Yes I have also been interested in this discussion as it concerns the people I work with.  Someone once said that if we run pre- entry classes everyday all day we would fill the centre just with running these classes.  Personally I don’t think our learners take any notice of the titles such as pre-entry we just tell them it’s a first/basic class. My concern is People used to want to learn English for the sake of it now it's all about getting British passports. Also funding if there is any is also geared towards citizenship. Soon people would want to do entry 3 but will happen to people who are not capable or can't progress. 



surji





Surji Cair

Community Development Manager

Millan Centre

Victor Street

BD9 4RA

01274 480691

mobile 0780 402 1603



-----Original Message-----

From: ESOL-Research discussion forum and message board [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Martin Nickson

Sent: 07 May 2013 11:30

To: [log in to unmask]

Subject: Re: What happens in pre-entry and E1 ESOL classes?



A very interesting discussion and I have been very interested in the posts.  



A lot of my teaching and research occurs outside of the " mainstream"  and a lot of non-mainstream/community  provision  seems to be dominated by pre-entry level learners (although like many people I prefer "beginners") . One reason for this is that this kind of provision is not streamed at all, so the classes are open to all. What can happen in these circumstances is that the teachers teach to the greatest percieved 'need' ie those learners who are most vulnerable. And this emphasis is completely understandable, but what may also  be happening (in community classes) is that more advanced learners drift away because the classes are too 'easy'. In the case of the class I teach, the more advanced learners didnt want to drift away, they wanted to stay. Which left the problem of  how to develop a class that includes learners who are very 'advanced' - IETLS 7 and above - and illiterate students. One possible bad  result of attempting to do this is that any particular session might  benefit no-one, or everyone inadequately, or just be a series of disconnected 'events'. I realise heterogeneity is a feature of ESOl ,but our classes were an extreme example. 



In 'my' class, we (=all of us 'learners' and 'teachers') spoke about what to do about this and how we could best help everyone in an area where all provision - mainstream and community-  has waiting lists, and where to focus on a 'level' would exclude someone.  We came up with an approach where we address each class as a topic. We then address each topic at a number of levels during each class so that each person in the class can address the topic at a level they fell comfortable with. 



Practically how this works is that we start off a class with the  'teachers' and the more advanced 'learners'  (the definitional boundaries are blurred) working with the beginners on a topic - translating, explaining, negotiating. As a class progresses, and once the beginners are comfortable with a task,  the more advanced learners move onto more 'advanced' exploration of the task (or subject or issue under discussion), and the 'teachers' work more with the beginners, but there is a constant movement within each session as beginners check with 'advanced' for clarification and 'teachers' provide support, floating between tables and groups. At the end of each session, or at certain key intervals, we discuss the topic as a class,  encouraging everyone to speak about the topic at whatever 'level' they are comfortable with. This sounds as if there is a very solid template for each session but its not as rigid as I have described here - I have simplified what actually happens to try to explain. 



It is a lot of work for everyone, and the class gets very loud, quite often, and it can appear a bit chaotic and messy to a visitor, as its not entirely clear sometimes 'who' is 'who',  but it was clear that where places in classes are limited, and no-one in our class  wanted to exclude anyone, we had to come up with something. So we use the skills we have - translation, teacher's knowledge of curricula and grammar etc., learner's experience - and have tried to pool them, focus on topics everyone wants to discuss and use whatever resources we have to facilitate that discussion. I realise this is not a new approach - dialogic approaches for example - and that in many ways it is not a different approach than manymainstream classes, it is just that we are applying it to a wider range of 'levels'. 



This approach is  probably not a solve all. For example, although we rely heavily on translation, throughout and during a class, we dont have every language bilingually (we can speak Russian, French, Arabic. Polish, Turkish, English in our class) so that an  illiterate person who speaks a language we cant support (for example one student speaks Portuguese but does not read)  is still isolated (see the point about Auerbach). And some people who have attended have rejected our class because they seemed uncomfortable with the class' approach and seemed to want a more traditional student-teacher classroom approach. But for twelve 'learners' and three 'teachers' the class 'works' I think. Some of the more advanced learners have gone on to take English exams, and the students who started off as absolute beginners are progressing, and are listened to, and participate in all our discussions.  



On a more general level though, I think that a lot of the answer to 'what happens in pre-entry classes' might be found outside the mainstream. This may be for a lot of reasons: not enough funding means not enough classes, who qualifies for classes via Jobcentre etc and that  people who may be isolated (through language, gender, legal status) may not want to engage with the mainstream. For me, and because of those possible obstacles, it is an essential question. Unfortunately however (and I know through experience) funding for such research is very hard to come by and I hope the British Council focus, and this thread,  highlights the need for more research in this area. 



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ESOL-Research is a forum for researchers and practitioners with an interest in research into teaching and learning ESOL. ESOL-Research is managed by James Simpson at the Centre for Language Education Research, School of Education, University of Leeds.

To join or leave ESOL-Research, visit

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