Before lining up with the oppressors, I throw in something of an 
apologia.  When Braille-reading students have applied to this 
institution in the past, from anywhere in the world, they have been 
sent Brailled copies of the prospectus, Brailled letters explaining 
entry requirements and support arrangements and generally anything else 
they require.  If your institution owns an embosser and you produce 
this material electronically (rather than using a quill pen), the cost 
is negligible.  Braille travels successfully in the post by being 
placed in a thick cardboard tube.  It has been necessary to do this 
some four times in nearly 10 years; each occasion was before SENDA was 
passed.  Braille copies of virtually anything are produced because this 
University is keen to attract students; the grounds for suggesting that 
we are compelled to do this seems doubtful. 

I'm losing track of the reasoning behind this argument.  However 
universities in this country are obliged to treat students or 
prospective students, people living in other countries are not covered 
by British law unless some diplomatic reciprocal arrangement has been 
made.  Whence the assumption that everyone everywhere is covered by 
the DDA and has a right to redress? For example, in what court would 
someone from a developing country bring suit?  Unless it is a British 
court, what obligation has a British institution to recognise the 
court's authority?  Until they are actually offered a place, many 
potential students around the world do not actually have a right of 
entry into the country, let alone protection under specifically British 
legislation.

Elsewhere, people have suggested that enquirers will not have access to 
PCs to read floppy disks.  In which case, how are they obtaining the 
Braille books that have enabled them to become suitably qualified to 
enter a British university?  Is the suggestion that elsewhere in the 
world, dedicated teams are labouring over Perkins' to produce one 
English text book after another?  (It might perhaps be best to remember 
that the teaching language is English and students have to demonstrate 
competence in that language.)  At the same time, behind several of 
the contribution to this thread lies the knowledge that many people 
in the world are comparatively poor and so do not have access to the 
kinds of technology that we have (recently) come to take for granted 
in north.  But are most people in the world potential students?  How 
is it that people without a PC or access to a web browser or an 
institution that will give them such access are going to find the 
£10,000 a year plus living expenses (and personal support costs, in 
many cases) that is the cost of entry into British higher education 
for the majority of the international population?  It is possible to 
imagine an infinite number of problems, but surely we are protected by 
the talisman of 'reasonable'?

Regards, Bernard


On Wed, 22 Jan 2003 01:22:00 -0000 Ian <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> On the one hand you could argue that producing a braille version (in the
> correct format/language) of the whole prospectus will create a huge and
> potentially unmanageable document and that it's very unlikely that an
> applicant would realistically want to read the whole prospectus anyway.
> On the other, all applicants should be able to browse all areas of the
> prospectus to choose their course(s) and be able to find out about other
> aspects of the institution before they choose where to study. The issue
> about whether the applicant is from the UK or overseas might be a red
> herring, as you'll probably need to show you're prepared for such a
> request - even if the first request isn't from the UK.
> 
> Audio-taped versions are just too difficult to use and many people won't
> have access to technology to facilitate access to an electronic format. I
> wonder if the best and most reasonable compromise would be to produce a
> recorded version on CD-Audio, with a braille/large print index. Once the
> recordings are made and masters produced, this would be a fairly easy way
> of distributing information. Information on each faculty/service could be
> placed on separate CDs and split into tracks so they can be more easily
> accessed and browsed through? Maybe the CD's could be dual format (CD-
> ROM/CD-Audio) so they work in computers as well as Cd players? Applicants
> could be given the option to request particular sections in Braille/Large
> Print after browsing the CD.
> 
> CD-Audio would also allow other 'print impaired' applicants to access the
> prospectus and might even appeal to other applicants too!
> 
> I wonder how colleagues in US-based institutions handle this request, as
> their legislation has been in place longer then in the UK.
> 
> Ian Francis
> 
> 
> 
> On 21 Jan 2003 at 15:28, Andy Velarde wrote:
> 
> > Thanks Celia and to other colleges. yes it is, however, the actual issue
> > still stands. Many thanks again, Andy
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Celia L. Cockburn" <[log in to unmask]>
> > To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2003 10:31 AM
> > Subject: Re: Information in alternative formats
> >
> >
> > > Dear Andy,
> > > This wouldn't happen to be in response to requests from a Pakistani-based
> > > "special school", would it?
> > > I suspect that we have all been sent a very worrying (and potentially
> > > expensive) request from a hotmail address.
> > >
> > >
> > > At 09:52 21/01/2003 +0000, you wrote:
> > > >Dear Colleagues/e-mail list members
> > > >I'd be grateful to hear your opinion regarding HEIs duties to provide
> > > >informations in alternative formats:
> > > >1.- Would you consider that our duties will be more specific from
> > September
> > > >2003? to what extent?
> > > >2.- Regarding uk and overseas applicants
> > > >Would you consider that different responsibilities arise according of the
> > > >location of the enquiry? For example, would universities have a duty to
> > > >provide prospectuses on Braille if the enquirier was located in the UK
> > and
> > > >can only access information on Braille. would we have the same level of
> > duty
> > > >if the enquirier were located overseas? Many thanks for your views, Best
> > > >regards, Andy Velarde University of Kent at Canterbury
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > >
> > > Celia
> > >
> > > Disability Co-ordinator, Equality & Diversity Department, King's College
> > > London, 7.36 James Clerk Maxwell Building, 57 Waterloo Road, London SE1
> > > 8WA  Tel: 020 7848 3799   Fax: 020 7848 3490. This message may have been
> > > typed, but on a typically bad RSI /WMSDs (Work related Musculoskeletal
> > > Disorders) day it will have been produced using voice recognition
> > software;
> > > please ignore any dictation errors I failed to recognise and correct.
> > >
> > > For appointments, please contact the Departmental
> > > Secretary  ([log in to unmask]); 020 7848 3398.
> > >
> >

----------------------
Bernard Doherty
Student Adviser
ACCESS Centre
Anglia Polytechnic University

Tel: 01223 363271 x2534
Fax: 01223 417730
Minicom: 01223 576155
[log in to unmask]