In general, there are a number of ways to create a correct sentence in
English; there are a virtually infinite number of ways to create an
incorrect sentence.  Learning by discovery in this case seems to be
rather a long way round for what is after all a largely mechanical
process.  Explaining why something is wrong really leaves the job half
done: would you teach a foreign language by simply explaining why
students have created wrong sentences and leave them to deduce the
rules?  Given enough time, it may work, but students' time is
limited and this is not what they are supposed to be studying.
Besides, for the most part, they have already experienced at least 14
years of full-time education where this method of student discovery has
been exploited to the full.  The fact that they cannot proof their own
work with confidence suggests that it is perhaps a flawed method based
on an inaccurate pedagogic model.  Why anyone would want to import the
model of thinking underlying English teaching in compulsory education
into a university is a mystery, particularly when it is to be imposed
on students whom it has so singularly already failed.

Regards, Bernard

On Mon, 9 Jun 2003 11:01:04 +0100 "Skinner J.P."
<[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> We do teach the alternatives. For example, we explain the reason why a particular sentence is not grammatically correct.  The students are then able to correct the sentence for themselves. They learn more that way than if we simply corrected it for them or gave them alternative words which are not their own.
>
> Janet
>
>
> ----------------------
> Janet Skinner
> Co-ordinator of Dyslexia Services
> University of Southampton
> 9 University Crescent
> [log in to unmask]
> 023 80595 562 (internal 25562)
> Dyslexia Services Reception 023 8059 2759
> (internal 22759) [log in to unmask]
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Boyce, Mark [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: 09 June 2003 10:40
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Sympathetic marking
>
>
> How will the students ever know the correct way to write is if they are not
> taught what the alternatives are? The stigma attached to proof-reading
> baffles me. My aim, when I start working with a student, is to ensure that,
> by the time they leave university, they are fully able to write flowing
> assignments that use grammar correctly. One of the best ways to do this is
> by proof-reading their work and then going over their mistakes with them,
> explaining why what they have written is incorrect and ensuring that they
> know not to make the mistake again. Inevitably this means that I have to
> show them alternatives.
>
> As long as I am not effecting the content or context of the student's work
> then it should not be an issue. If, however, the student was studying on an
> English Language course the situation would be very different.
>
> Therefore, as far as I can see, there is absolutely no problem with
> proof-reading the work of a dyslexic student as long as the amendments made
> are explained to the student in person.
>
> Mark Boyce
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Keith Silvester [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: 09 June 2003 10:28
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Sympathetic marking
>
>
> Janet,
>
> Well, putting it like that, I wouldn't disagree with you. The more a student
> can do for her/himself the better, obviously.  I come at it as someone who
> is not a paid dyslexia tutor.
>
> Keith
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Skinner J.P. [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: 09 June 2003 09:34
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Sympathetic marking
>
>
> Keith
>
> I feel very strongly that dyslexia tutors should not proof read students'
> work or alter students' work in any way at all.  It is fine to provide
> editing skills that will enable students to correct their own work, but not
> to correct it for them.  That would be giving the students an unfair
> advantage, in my opinion. On an individual basis we do talk through
> coursework with students and point out any errors of grammar and sentence
> structure, and explain why it is wrong - we do not offer alternatives.
> Perhaps that is the same thing and it is the term 'proof reading' which is
> being interpreted differently! I perhaps read more into the term than you do
> - proof reading  could be seen as just pointing out mistakes and not
> correcting them.
>
> Janet
> ----------------------
> Janet Skinner
> Co-ordinator of Dyslexia Services
> University of Southampton
> 9 University Crescent
> [log in to unmask]
> 023 80595 562 (internal 25562)
> Dyslexia Services Reception 023 8059 2759
> (internal 22759) [log in to unmask]
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Keith Silvester [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: 06 June 2003 14:30
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Sympathetic marking
>
>
> Janet,
>
> I'm surprised that proof-reading is such a no-no.  I recommend that a
> student finds someone to do this, if they don't have immediate access to a
> dyslexia tutor.  On occasion, I have done this for a student facing a tight
> deadline with no access to a tutor.  After all, proof-reading is only an
> advanced form of spellchecker.  Eventually, spellcheckers will become even
> more sophisticated!
>
> Keith Silvester
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Skinner J.P. [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: 06 June 2003 09:02
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Sympathetic marking
>
>
> Re: recent communication about sympathetic marking.
>
> At the University of Southampton if  dyslexic students are eligible for
> extra time in examinations, they will also be eligible for 'sympathetic
> marking' in examinations.  Under examination conditions they are likely to
> make more errors than their non-dyslexic peers because of slow sleed of
> information processing etc. We feel this consideration is totally justified.
> The coloured sticker system is meant to ensure that in anonymous marking a
> dyslexic student is not penalised for typical dyslexic spelling and syntax
> errors.  The sticker system is simply to bring to the attention of the
> marker that it is a dyslexic script and that there may be errors in written
> expression.  If, however, language skills are being assessed, then no
> consideration is given.
>
> Sympathetic marking is not allowed for coursework because there is the
> opportunity for students to receive academic study skill tutorials with our
> dyslexia tutors. Dyslexia Services can provide help with editing skills.
> Dyslexia tutors can also read students' work aloud to them so that they can
> hear whether they have written what they have intended to write.  Guidance
> can be given about the kind of grammatical, structural errors individual
> students are making.  Under no circumstances would we undertake to proof
> read students' coursework, however, or comment on the subject matter of the
> work.
>
> Janet
> ----------------------
> Janet Skinner
> Co-ordinator of Dyslexia Services
> University of Southampton
> 9 University Crescent
> [log in to unmask]
> 023 80595 562 (internal 25562)
> Dyslexia Services Reception 023 8059 2759
> (internal 22759) [log in to unmask]

----------------------
Bernard Doherty
Student Adviser
ACCESS Centre
Anglia Polytechnic University

Tel: 01223 363271 x2534
Fax: 01223 417730
Minicom: 01223 576155
[log in to unmask]