In message
<[log in to unmask]>, at
13:12:06 on Fri, 8 Jan 2016, Lawrence Serewicz
<[log in to unmask]> writes
>Roland and Chris,
>Thanks for the interesting discussion on the bill.
>
>I was struck by the CCTV analogy. While of interest, I think it betrays
>a conceptual problem facing the legislation.
>
>I will set out what I mean on two points. The first is minor and
>relatively obvious. The second is more elaborate and speculative.
>
>First, CCTV no longer needs an army of spotters. With facial
>recognition software a machine can track people and find them in real
>time without storing anything.
That rather depends what you are trying to track, and when. If it's
cars, and in arrears, which although getaway cars were being driven in a
manner that someone looking at the live feed wouldn't send out a patrol
car to intercept them, you need to have stored the footage.
>Second, the bill suffers from a central paradox, flaw, within
>liberalism as expressed in the technological possibilities. (Ok, what
>does that mean?)
>
>Intelligence and policing are related but different. Traditionally
>Intelligence was about preventing something and policing was responding
>to something.
>
>In intelligence, there is less need for rigorous evidence as it is not
>being tested in court.
Agreed, and much of the drift of police use of comms data since RIPA and
before is to identify who you need to go and interview or search their
premises. And use the evidence which then emerges.
>In policing, the goal is to connect the dots from the event to the
>alleged perpetrators. They have to gather as much evidence as is
>available.
Back in the day, most of that evidence was from examining things in the
real world (having perhaps worked out from comms data where to look) but
I agree that now that real life is moving online so much, evidence of
things happening online becomes more important.
>If they are being proactive, the increased concern of this digital
>domain, they are trying to prevent something from occurring.
I don't think the police do very much of that. The vast majority of
their work is still reactive.
>The central question or implicit question, of which talk of bulk
>collection or other types of collection is immaterial, is how people
>are we willing to let die from violent deaths so that we can live in
>freedom.
As long as the sacrificial people dying are not *our* friends and
relatives.
--
Roland Perry
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