Hi Felicity,
Can I ask why the training wasn't part of your DSA or related to the
software supplied? Maybe you would prefer to reply off -list as many seem to
do. If it none of my business then I respect your privacy and apologise. :-)
Thanks,
Alex
Alex Larg
[log in to unmask]
07931 561 877 or 07916 175 077
Freelance Assistive Technology Trainer
Freelance study needs assessor
Former Disability Officer
On 28/3/07 08:36, "Felicity Burgess" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> I'd just like to point out that that training wasn't part of my DSA
> assessment or related to software supplied by DSA (so doesn't necessarily
> come into this discussion).
>
>
>
> Quoting alex larg <[log in to unmask]>:
>
> and
>> not
>> just on a Tuesday morning (to quote a student's comment on list - to
>> which I
>> listen and take note!). >
>> Alex
>>
>> Alex Larg
>>
>> [log in to unmask]
>> 07931 561 877 or 07916 175 077
>> Freelance Assistive Technology Trainer
>> Freelance study needs assessor
>> Former Disability Officer
>>
>>
>> On 27/3/07 14:46, "Nasser" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>>> I think part of the problem is that some LEAs when they approve the
>> main
>>> recommendation they leave off the training and ask the student to make
>> the
>>> arrangement in their own time when they need it rather than inform the
>>> training providers. Unfortunately due to numerous pressures of work and
>>> other matters a significant proportion of the students either choose
>> not to
>>> do it or they are unsure what to do and whom to speak to.
>>>
>>> The usual expectation from most of the students is that the suppliers
>> will
>>> be providing this but since more and more of this service is being
>> provided
>>> by the centre or the institution the suppliers are not able to follow
>> up
>>> this and hence this gets lost in the system. I am sure better
>> coordination
>>> and communication between the various providers is the key to higher
>> uptake.
>>>
>>>
>>> Best wishes
>>>
>>> Nasser Siabi
>>> Managing Director
>>> Microlink PC (UK) Ltd
>>> Direct: 02380 240 316
>>> Mobile: 07870603128
>>>
>>> This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
>> intended
>>> solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are
>> addressed.
>>> If you receive this e-mail by mistake, please advise the sender
>> immediately
>>> by using the reply facility in your e-mail software. Also destroy and
>> delete
>>> the message from your computer. Please note that any views or opinions
>>> presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not
>>> necessarily represent those of Microlink. Finally, the recipient should
>>> check this email and any attachments for the presence of viruses.
>> Microlink
>>> accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by
>> this
>>> email. Any modification of the contents of this e-mail is strictly
>>> prohibited unless expressly authorised by the sender.
>>> Microlink House, Brickfield Lane, Chandlers Ford, Southampton SO53 4DP
>>> (Company number: 3325643)
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Discussion list for disabled students and their support staff.
>>> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Maiden, Arnold
>>> Sent: 27 March 2007 14:28
>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>> Subject: Re: training
>>>
>>> It seems to me that (assuming that the student's are in receipt of DSA)
>>> that the issue of Training should be discussed at the time of the
>>> Assessment and then any recommendations will be in the
>>> report/Application for DSA.
>>>
>>> This is certainly my practice and if I wasn't recommending training for
>>> software that the student had not previously used I would discuss this
>>> with the student and explain why I was not recommending it in the final
>>> report.
>>>
>>> I also, wherever possible, include in the report, contact information
>>> for AT Trainer, Dyslexia Support Tutor, Equipment Supplier/s, etc.
>>> wherever this is appropriate. I would also hope that these various
>>> suppliers would also contact the student direct once approval is
>> granted
>>> but often students move, change mobile number, etc. and are not always
>>> easy to contact so I see info in the report as a fall back position for
>>> the student.
>>>
>>> I am pretty confident in saying that most assessors do pretty much the
>>> same as I do but I guess that not all students read their reports.
>>>
>>> Arnold Maiden
>>> Assessor & Assistive Technology Advisor
>>> Leeds Metropolitan University
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Discussion list for disabled students and their support staff.
>>> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Emma Wright
>>> Sent: 27 March 2007 14:10
>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>> Subject: Re: training
>>>
>>> I just want to clarify something I said the other day and should have
>>> been clearer about at the time... I've spoken to a few students from
>>> a few universities and although all of these have said they were not
>>> offered training, they are not likely to be representative of all
>>> students, and my next task is to contact the staff responsible for
>>> offering training to see what percentage of the whole are offering
>>> training. Indeed, one university representative has already been in
>>> touch to say they do offer training to most students. The students at
>>> that university actually said that although they hadn't been offered
>>> training, they didn't really feel they needed it anyway (which may
>>> translate to an offer having been made but turned down!).
>>>
>>> Training wasn't something I covered in a big way during my interviews
>>> as students gave me the impression that it wasn't that important to
>>> them, but the discussion on this board has made me rethink that. I
>>> know that personally I could have done with some training had there
>>> been enough money available for it, but it seems not all students feel
>>> the same. What I was intending to highlight in my post was the
>>> apparent difference between the assumption on this board that training
>>> is a given and students perceptions that they were not offered any
>>> (which may of course be incorrect) or that did not want it. I wonder
>>> how this translates in terms of feedback on the quality of training if
>>> students don't feel it is very important anyway, and on how good they
>>> perceive the equipment to be if they haven't been trained how to make
>>> full use of it.
>>>
>>> Anyway, this leads me to ask the following questions of you all, do
>>> you have any figures, or even anecdotes, hunches, etc, regarding the
>>> number of students that are offered training and those that take it
>>> up? What sort of software/hardware do you tend to offer training on,
>>> and which do you not? Does the funding tend to be readily available
>>> for this training? Do you have in-house or external trainers on hand
>>> for this? Do your students seem to feel training is important, and if
>>> not, why not? Any responses to any of the questions will be very
>>> welcome (preferably off list - [log in to unmask]) and will be
>>> used as background information to my PhD research.
>>>
>>> Emma
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 27/03/07, Nasser <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>> Hi Alex
>>>>
>>>> Can you let me know how you get your training referrals? Do you
>>> contact
>>>> students or are they passed on to you by the institution or the
>>> supplier?
>>>>
>>>> The reason for asking is that we often come across students that were
>>>> supposed to be trained by the institution but we find that they have
>>> not
>>>> received the training, In such circumstances we would like to refer
>>> them
>>>> back to other training providers who are based in the vicinity and if
>>> this
>>>> is provided by an assessment centre or University then even better. We
>>>> strongly feel receiving the training at early stages will prevent
>>> potential
>>>> problems and will significantly improve the quality of life for the
>>>> students. I think prevention is always better than the cure.
>>>>
>>>> We have our own trainers too but we either use them if the LEA
>>> requests us
>>>> to carry out the job or there are no other training providers nearby.
>>> We
>>>> previously found that pressuring students towards getting the training
>>>> confused some of them as they had been contacted and trained by other
>>>> trainers we hence had ended up duplicating the job which meant we
>>> could not
>>>> be paid for the training sessions. I think it is safer for us to let
>>> the
>>>> LEAs place the order with us to avoid such situation as well as not
>>> stepping
>>>> on other people's toes.
>>>>
>>>> At the moment we operate a system of providing information to some
>>> training
>>>> providers on the delivery of the equipment to the students so that the
>>>> training can be carried out at the earliest opportunity. I think the
>>> longer
>>>> the student has the equipment without the training the less likely it
>>>> becomes for them to take the recommended training. If you are
>>> interested in
>>>> receiving this information for your students please let me know.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Best wishes
>>>>
>>>> Nasser Siabi
>>>> Managing Director
>>>> Microlink PC (UK) Ltd
>>>> Direct: 02380 240 316
>>>> Mobile: 07870603128
>>>>
>>>> This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
>>> intended
>>>> solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are
>>> addressed.
>>>> If you receive this e-mail by mistake, please advise the sender
>>> immediately
>>>> by using the reply facility in your e-mail software. Also destroy and
>>> delete
>>>> the message from your computer. Please note that any views or opinions
>>>> presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not
>>>> necessarily represent those of Microlink. Finally, the recipient
>>> should
>>>> check this email and any attachments for the presence of viruses.
>>> Microlink
>>>> accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by
>>> this
>>>> email. Any modification of the contents of this e-mail is strictly
>>>> prohibited unless expressly authorised by the sender.
>>>> Microlink House, Brickfield Lane, Chandlers Ford, Southampton SO53
>>> 4DP
>>>> (Company number: 3325643)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Discussion list for disabled students and their support staff.
>>>> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of alex larg
>>>> Sent: 27 March 2007 01:47
>>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>>> Subject: FW: training
>>>>
>>>> Hi Emma,
>>>>
>>>> I am a freelance trainer, an assessor, a former disability officer and
>>> a
>>>> campaigner and so have an interest in your comments.
>>>>
>>>> I aim to offer a person-centred approach to the clients' training
>>> sessions
>>>> that I deliver and I don't feel that I need to know anything about a
>>> person
>>>> before I train them. I feel that this advance knowledge can lead to
>>> people
>>>> having certain preconceptions which isn't healthy and can lead to
>>> laziness
>>>> and complacency.
>>>>
>>>> I train in most software strategies, with the exception of JAWS as I
>>> am not
>>>> a user myself and don't currently have the time to develop my
>>> knowledge of
>>>> that complex program. I probably don't know everything about every
>>> program,
>>>> but I know how to find out quickly. I learn something new everyday
>>> from the
>>>> questions I am asked by clients - this may sound like I don't know
>>> much, but
>>>> there is a lot of truth to the saying - the more you know the more you
>>>> realize you don't know. I won't know anything soon :-)
>>>>
>>>> I also know what programs should do and so can reassure clients when
>>>> programs don't do what they should that it is not they (the client)
>>> who are
>>>> doing something wrong. This situation can be intimidating and off
>>> putting
>>>> for users. Again I feel this is exacerbated by underspecified
>>> machines.
>>>> Another thing I keep going on about on one list or another.
>>>>
>>>> Wherever possible I would try to relate training to the work that a
>>> student
>>>> has on the go. Where this is not possible the training might be aimed
>>> at
>>>> creating an individualised user manual for the user as they know how
>>> they
>>>> learn and how they will best remember. Visual, textual and/or
>>> aural/oral as
>>>> required. They may not know they know this, but I aim to help them to
>>>> realize this or at least begin to consider this and then suggest they
>>> carry
>>>> this philosophy through to other pieces of work.
>>>> I use plain English - non jargon - but using targeted essential
>>> language
>>>> which is used within computer systems - widely used vocabulary
>>> necessary to
>>>> function and interact. I will patiently repeat this language and any
>>> points,
>>>> if so required, until the client is comfortable and has grasped the
>>>> necessary information.
>>>>
>>>> I also don't have a set way of doing things as everyone is different
>>> and in
>>>> my opinion good training has a solid framework basis, but requires
>>>> flexibility to wrap around the clients' own learning styles.
>>>>
>>>> I work all around the country. Please contact me off list for any
>>> further
>>>> information. I would also be interested in the names of the three
>>>> universities you mention, off list.
>>>>
>>>> Best wishes,
>>>>
>>>> Alex
>>>>
>>>> Alex Larg
>>>>
>>>> [log in to unmask]
>>>> 07931 561 877 or 07916 175 077
>>>> Freelance Assistive Technology Trainer
>>>> Freelance study needs assessor
>>>> Former Disability Officer
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------ Forwarded Message
>>>> From: Emma Wright <[log in to unmask]>
>>>> Reply-To: "Discussion list for disabled students and their support
>>> staff."
>>>> <[log in to unmask]>
>>>> Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2007 18:51:12 +0100
>>>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>>>> Subject: Re: training
>>>>
>>>> I keep hearing all this about training, but I've never been offered
>>>> any! Nor have any of the students I've interviewed as part of my
>>>> research across (so far) three universities. What sort of training
>>>> for what sort of software tends to be offered?
>>>>
>>>> Emma
>>>>
>>>> On 26/03/07, George Bell <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>>> Might I perhaps suggest that people take a serious look at
>>>>> http://www.bcab.org.uk/training.html
>>>>>
>>>>> This is an initiative taken by the British Computer
>>>>> Association of the Blind (BCAB) in response to complaints
>>>>> about poor standards of training in the use of I.T.
>>>>> equipment.
>>>>>
>>>>> Many organisations, including the Department of Employment
>>>>> for example, are now insisting that contracted trainers are
>>>>> BTCS (BCAB Trainer Certification Scheme) approved.
>>>>>
>>>>> Food for thought?
>>>>>
>>>>> George Bell.
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Discussion list for disabled students and their
>>>>> support staff. [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf
>>>>> Of David Austen
>>>>> Sent: 26 March 2007 13:51
>>>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>>>> Subject: training
>>>>>
>>>>> Posted without comment
>>>>> extract from the 'form' letter sent out to students
>>>>> regarding their DSA
>>>>> provision. This is from a local LEA
>>>>> ( I do not think it is appropriate to name which one).
>>>>>
>>>>> "Recently, some students have informed us that they felt
>>>>> pressurized
>>>>> into accepting training provided by their University.
>>>>> Please note that the LEA only uses training companies who
>>>>> are
>>>>> thoroughly reliable and have many years' experience.with
>>>>> equipment
>>>>> training for disabled students.
>>>>> If you feel that you have been treated unfairly by any
>>>>> individual or by
>>>>> a professional body, please contact us immediately and we
>>>>> will ensure
>>>>> appropriate action is taken".
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Emma Jane Wright
>>>> School of Sociology and Social Policy
>>>> University of Nottingham
>>>>
>>>> [log in to unmask]
>>>>
>>>> www.accessingmaterials.org.uk
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------ End of Forwarded Message
>>>>
>>>> Sent using the Microsoft Entourage 2004 for Mac Test Drive.
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> Sent using the Microsoft Entourage 2004 for Mac Test Drive.
>>
>>
>>
>
Sent using the Microsoft Entourage 2004 for Mac Test Drive.
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