Great answer, Margarida, I agree wholeheartedly and just wish that more
lecturers could really take the time to understand the NEEDS of their
students and how to communicate effectively with them - after all that
is the prime task in being a lecturer.
I'm not dysleixc, [at least I don't know that I am] but I nearly always
take notes during a conference presentation. I often throw them away as
I leave the room. WHY? Because taking notes helps me to concentrate on
what is being said / shown to me. Must be some form of kinaesthetic
learning I guess. Even if I keep the notes I never refer back to them.
It just helps me to imprint the information on my mind.
Funny old world! But whatever works.................
John
-----Original Message-----
From: Discussion list for disabled students and their support staff.
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Margarida Dolan
Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2005 10:20 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Lecture notes in advance
Dear Scott,
As I am preparing for a lecture I am giving in 2h time, I find relevant
to
respond to your email. You say:
> most of the classes I teach are discussion based and interactive.
So are mine, and the discussions are "guided discussions" not
discussions about
whatever we feel like discussing.
>While there are points I know I want to make I can rarely predict how I
am
> going to make them and if I provided notes in advance they are as
likely
> to be misleading as helpful.
I really cannot see how you can justify this. As I prepare any lecture,
I
prepare its context, I revise important past authors and new
perspectives by
recent authors; who is in favour/against of what is said, and how I
position
myself within the field of knowledge, and how my opinions evolved. I
enable
students to challenge and add to these perspective, and to analyse each
others
contributions.
And I prepare materials, including PowerPoint/acetates/notes. If a
student
brings into the discussion something new, or if I remember something
interesting I have not anticipated, I will suggest they complete the
notes, and
ask them to email me to send further info.
>I often encourage students to put their pencils and paper down and
actively
>listen and be engaged in the conversation rather than take dictation.
I do
>work out post lecture notes in some cases.
Just to tell you about my own learning needs when I was an
undergraduate- I
needed to write notes or do drawings as a means to engage in what was
being
said. Writing and chewing pens might increase the activity of the motor
cortex, and generally increase the activity of the brain and can support
some
individuals to pay attention.
If I was to perceive that a lecturer was encouraging the students to put
the
pencils down, I would probaly also put my pencil down as I would not
want to
look different- and as a result I might switch off, and feel really
stressed
that the lecturer might ask me to contribute to the discussion.
> All that said the underlying question is if a student can not get
notes
> because a lecturer does not teach from notes can you reasonable expect
> them to change their style when except for the access issue no one
else
> would?
The answer to your question is in the DDA and DED. It is not up to us
lecturers
to decide what the needs of the students are, based on what are needs
are.
I hope this informs the debate,
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
Margarida Dolan PhD Phone: 0044(0)1225
383241
Learning Support Tutor and Staff Developer Fax: 0044(0)1225
386709
Learning Support Service
University of Bath
Claverton Down, Bath BA2 7AY, UK
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
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This
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contrary.
Quoting "Lissner, Scott" <[log in to unmask]>:
> I don't want to make this a back and forth about Scott. I
occasionally
> teach statistics and there advance notes are indeed critical to me (or
> the problems won't solve right) and helpful to all of the students. In
> those types of classes I do create and provide notes. On the other
hand
> most of the classes I teach are discussion based and interactive.
While
> there are points I know I want to make I can rarely predict how I am
> going to make them and if I provided notes in advance they are as
likely
> to be misleading as helpful. I often encourage students to put their
> pencils and paper down and actively listen and be engaged in the
> conversation rather than take dictation. I do work out post lecture
> notes in some cases.
>
> All that said the underlying question is if a student can not get
notes
> because a lecturer does not teach from notes can you reasonable expect
> them to change their style when except for the access issue no one
else
> would?
>
>
>
>
> L. Scott Lissner, ADA Coordinator
> Office Of The Provost
>
> 292-6207(v); 688-8605(tty); 688-3665(fax)
> HTTP://ADA.OSU.EDU
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Discussion list for disabled students and their support staff.
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of KC Thomas, Centre for
> Access and Communication Studies
> Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2005 4:49 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Lecture notes in advance
>
> In response to Scott's email I would just query:
> Whether the lecturer is truly writing the notes the night before or
just
> wanting to avoid the responsibility for earlier preparation and
> circulation of notes, however brief
>
> If so, I would guess the lecturer in question would also want to avoid
> 'advance time needed for conversation'.
>
> Finally, Scott writes that his 'lecture style that has been successful
> for the last 20 plus years' - while not doubting this or Scott's
> professionalism, I would just ask - successful for whom? Student
> profiles have changed enormously in 20 years and as practitioners we
> need to be learners too and develop our practices to create the most
> successful learning experiences for all our students.
>
>
>
> --On 15 November 2005 12:14 -0500 "Lissner, Scott" <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
>
> > I am writing from the US and am only passingly familiar the DDA,
SENDA
>
> > and the Code of Practice but it is a familiar issue and I have some
> > practical thoughts that might be helpful and some conceptual
musings.
> >
> > If the lecturer is truly writing notes the night before then my
guess
> > is that he or she is not typically giving copies to students to read
> > but may be putting some notes on the board during the lecture and
that
>
> > is what the student will be missing. If this is the case than the
only
>
> > advance time needed is for conversion and if the Lecturer can e-mail
a
>
> > digital copy that could be printed out in Braille or read with
> > adaptive technology this student would be as prepared as everyone
> else.
> >
> > There are lecturers, myself included, that do not lecture from
> > meaningful notes. I will have jotted an occasional name few key
> > figures or dates and sometimes a topic or two but I rarely have
notes.
>
> > Would it be reasonable to ask me to change a lecture style that has
> been
> > successful for the last 20 plus years? If I put some facts and
> figures
> > on the board I would need to verbalize them and arranging a
> > scribe/note taker for the student might make sense but not providing
> > notes where none exist.
> >
> > The conundrum is trying to determine if what the lecturer is
> > presenting about their creation and use of lecture notes is true or
a
> > pretext for discrimination.
> >
> >
> >
> > L. Scott Lissner, ADA Coordinator
> > Office Of The Provost, The Ohio State University 292-6207(v);
> > 688-8605(tty); 688-3665(fax) HTTP://ADA.OSU.EDU
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Discussion list for disabled students and their support staff.
> > [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Jackson, Elizabeth
> > Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2005 11:56 AM
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: Re: Lecture notes in advance
> >
> > Hi Kate
> >
> > If the student is blind or partially sighted (B or PS) and only
given
> > the notes on the day of the lesson they will not have the same
rights
> > of access as their sighted peers and, therefore, not be included in
> > the lesson - it's the same as giving a B or PS learner the handouts
in
>
> > lesson, asking them to read it and then discuss with the rest of the
> > group. This is, ultimately, excluding the B or PS learner from
> > participating, which is then seen as discrimination!
> >
> > Is the first time the lecturer has ever delivered the course, then I
> > can understand that they may have anything prepared, although this
is
> > a little unusual. If the lecturer has delivered the course before,
> > then there is no excuse for not having handouts or resources
prepared!
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Liz Jackson
> > Acting Regional Manager
> > Royal National Institute of the Blind
> > London & South East Regional Services
> > 0207 391 2138 / 07789812230
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Discussion list for disabled students and their support staff.
> > [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Katy Mann
> > Sent: 15 November 2005 16:27
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: Lecture notes in advance
> >
> > We have a lecturer who is claiming they cannot provide lecture notes
> > in advance for students with disabilities as they only prepare the
> > lecture the night before and therefore should not be expected to do
> > so. My feeling is that, with consideration to the current
legislation,
>
> > and in terms of encouraging good practice, that this contravenes the
> > notion of a 'reasonable adjustment'
> >
> > I could find no specific examples that relate directly to this
within
> > the Code of Practice but would appreciate any advice/ feedback from
> > anyone else who has encountered this problem. How did you deal with
> it?
> >
> > Many Thanks
> >
> > Katy
> > Katy Mann
> > Disability Adviser
> > West End sites
> > Room CG80, Chiltern Building
> > University of Westminster
> > 35 Marylebone Road
> > London NW1 5LS
> >
> > --
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>
>
>
> ----------------------
> KC Thomas,
> Organising Tutor: Personal Support Worker Training 2005 Project
> Co-ordinator: Employment Scene 2005-6 Centre for Access and
> Communication Studies, University of Bristol [log in to unmask]
> 0117 954 5718
>
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