'Berct' ?! Brecht.
(self-burked)
2008/6/7 David Bircumshaw <[log in to unmask]>:
> further to that, Coriolanus is the play where Shakespearean theatre
> gets on tricky ground: as you no doubt know, it was banned in the
> Allied Zones in Germany after the war as the Nazis had a very
> particular interpretation of it. And I guess Berct would say, told you
> so, this is where sympathetic identification leads you.
> Same trouble with Star Trek: beam me up to the Modern Office in your
> Personal Space, Scotty.
> Data would say it's just a question of being human, but how would he know?
>
> 2008/6/7 David Bircumshaw <[log in to unmask]>:
>> Yes, Andrew, Coriolanus certainly is +interesting+. It's a very
>> difficult conundrum too, because it's hard to be sure where, if
>> anywhere, Shakespeare is actually leading us. It seems to be on all
>> sides and on none at all. By contrast, when George Eliot wrote Felix
>> Holt it's very clear where her she is on the Chartist riots in
>> Nuneaton: I'm afraid her book is a very very bourgeois re-write of
>> events, oh dear.
>> But with Coriolanus and the anti-enclosure corn-riots and Shakespeare,
>> man that's muddy. They kicked off here in Leicestershire, at
>> Cotesbach, that's where the term Leveller originated, it meant someone
>> who tears down hedges, and Shakespeare was very much aware of them,
>> that's sure.
>> I'm okay with Mr W.S. up to King Lear and Anthony & Clepatra, but I'm
>> not clear where he's going with Coriolanus and Timon (admittedly
>> that's probably a first draft) nor where we are in happyville among
>> the horrors in the late plays.
>> King Lear, as I say, I quite literally know where I am with that:
>> sitting in a flat a hundred yards or so outside Lear's Castle walls
>> and parallel to the line of attack of the Royalist troops in 1645 when
>> they temporarily re-took the Puritan-held City on a Graveyard. so I
>> don't have to take part in the Oxford-Cambridge wars anymore as I'm
>> just an onlooker for the moment. Where next though, ah that's a
>> question.
>>
>> 2008/6/7 andrew burke <[log in to unmask]>:
>>> Hey, Roger, as a once-upon-a-time surrealistic playwright in 70s I can
>>> understand you preferring modern plays, but I was in London two years back,
>>> walking to the Tate Modern when I spyed the Globe: amazing. So I went in -
>>> five pounds, as someone has pointed out and a full-on traditional version of
>>> Coriolanus, one of my favourite S plays. So I was a pleased tourist. I
>>> recognised the lead as a tv guy (out of Spooks and such BBC fare). Not much
>>> else of London is so English! (Maybe the USAmericans will buy the Globe and
>>> move it to the centre of 'civilisation'.)
>>>
>>> So, as a tourist, I really enjoyed The Globe.
>>>
>>> Andrew
>>>
>>>
>>> 2008/6/7 Roger Day <[log in to unmask]>:
>>>
>>>> You got me there. It's my prejudice. New plays I can dig but for me
>>>> any money wasted on Shakespeare is money not being spent on modern
>>>> theatre. But hey, I'm in a minority here.
>>>>
>>>> http://www.roundhouse.org.uk/ - not the histories *again*!!!!!! At
>>>> least the Daily Mail likes it I suppose.
>>>>
>>>> Roger
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Jun 6, 2008 at 5:50 PM, Heather Taylor <[log in to unmask]>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> > Hmmm....I'm curious if people who are writing about the globe here have
>>>> been
>>>> > there? Or go there regularly. Not only are they doing Shakespeare in
>>>> modern
>>>> > ways to packed audiences but they are putting on new plays that are
>>>> written
>>>> > for that space. Some of the work is fresh and exciting. People were
>>>> even
>>>> > fainting during Titus Andronicus which was a bloody affair. Also it's £5
>>>> for
>>>> > groundling seats - best priced theatre in town!
>>>> >
>>>> > Also Shakespeare is all over the west end and in theatres around London -
>>>> > Cheek by Jowl doing Troillus and Cressida at Barbican and doing a world
>>>> > tour, RSC doing the Henrys and both Richards at the Roundhouse - I also
>>>> say
>>>> > a marvellously modern and sold out Macbeth starring Patrick Stewart last
>>>> > November that had an extended run...
>>>> >
>>>> > And I'm not a tourist. I'm a playwright and producer.
>>>> >
>>>> > -----Original Message-----
>>>> > From: Roger Day [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
>>>> > Sent: 06 June 2008 17:32
>>>> > To: [log in to unmask]
>>>> > Subject: Re: Some bits
>>>> >
>>>> > I think, also, the globe is a little more insidious than that. I think
>>>> > it's part of the heritage industry; it's designed for tourism. For
>>>> > God, Harry etc. Nostalgia. And toy-trains - the globe reminds me of
>>>> > those railway enthusiasts who have to get right *every* detail of York
>>>> > circa 1929.
>>>> >
>>>> > Roger
>>>> >
>>>> > On Fri, Jun 6, 2008 at 4:32 PM, David Bircumshaw
>>>> > <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>> >> Almost anything's potentially a tourist trap these days. That's what
>>>> >> living in a culture focused on marketing does to things.
>>>> >> My masterplan for the coming years is to persuade the Arts Council
>>>> >> that I'm a rare cultural antiquity. I expect stiff competition from
>>>> >> Patrick.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 2008/6/6 Roger Day <[log in to unmask]>:
>>>> >>> the Globe is a tourist trap, little more, little less.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> On Thu, Jun 5, 2008 at 8:01 PM, David Bircumshaw
>>>> >>> <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>> >>>> The Globe isn't government subsidized you know.
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> 2008/6/5 Roger Day <[log in to unmask]>:
>>>> >>>>> Indeed. But would that make Hamlet as good as the Mousetrap? At least
>>>> >>>>> the Mousetrap didn't have to be subsidized to be shown.
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>> Roger
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Jun 5, 2008 at 2:58 PM, David Bircumshaw
>>>> >>>>> <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>> >>>>>> The Mousetrap ran for years.
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>> 2008/6/5 Roger Day <[log in to unmask]>:
>>>> >>>>>>> Very little Shakespeare is played out on the professional west-end
>>>> >>>>>>> stage these days. Most of it is in the Shakespearean churches.
>>>> >>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>> On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 12:05 AM, Mark Weiss <
>>>> [log in to unmask]>
>>>> > wrote:
>>>> >>>>>>>> Roger: This is silly. Shakespeare is performed on the profesional
>>>> > stage in
>>>> >>>>>>>> the US all the time. Two years ago I saw a wonderful production of
>>>> > As You
>>>> >>>>>>>> Like It in Tucson. There are sold out summer Shakespeare festivals
>>>> > in
>>>> >>>>>>>> Oregon, New York, and Connecticut that I'm aware of. When I was a
>>>> > teenager a
>>>> >>>>>>>> complete cycle of the history plays was done at a major downtown
>>>> > theater in
>>>> >>>>>>>> NY. Lear was done on Broadway last year.
>>>> >>>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>> The ways of the censor tend to be unpredictable, perhaps because
>>>> >>>>>>>> unpredictability is such a potent weapon.
>>>> >>>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>> Mark
>>>> >>>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>> At 05:40 PM 5/25/2008, you wrote:
>>>> >>>>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>>> one swallow a summer does not make.
>>>> >>>>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Sun, May 25, 2008 at 6:35 PM, Mark Weiss
>>>> > <[log in to unmask]>
>>>> >>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>> >>>>>>>>> > Right now the hottest ticket on Broadway is MacBeth, with
>>>> Patrick
>>>> >>>>>>>>> > Stewart in
>>>> >>>>>>>>> > the title role. The run is sold out--even the scalpers are at a
>>>> > loss.
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >
>>>> >>>>>>>>> > Mark
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >
>>>> >>>>>>>>> > At 12:47 PM 5/25/2008, you wrote:
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> Those were the days - the Lord Chamberlain (member of the
>>>> Royal
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> Household) and his malign influence on the British Theatre. In
>>>> > another
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> email list, a long time ago, I mooted the theory that
>>>> > shakespeare's
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> continuing popularity down the ages was due in part to the
>>>> > Bard's
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> acceptability before the LC. My logic, fwiw, ran thus: you
>>>> want
>>>> > to put
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> on a play and in those days, the least likeliest plays to get
>>>> > banned
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> were Shakespeares. So, you play safe, put on the Bard. Until
>>>> the
>>>> > 60s,
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> when the LC threw away his blue pencil. Nowadays, S hardly
>>>> > appears on
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> the commercial stage.
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> American bannings are two a penny: their school libraries have
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> committees which are battle-grounds for the
>>>> inclusion/exclusion
>>>> > of
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> books. Harry Potter is a notorious example of this - the poor,
>>>> > deluded
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> fundies trying to stave off the influence of the heathen
>>>> (WTF?).
>>>> > There
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> are lists on line of books that have been banned in the US.
>>>> Are
>>>> > there
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> any for the UK?
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> Roger
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> On Sun, May 25, 2008 at 9:38 AM, David Bircumshaw
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > Lear was banned from performance between 1788-1820 when
>>>> > George III
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > was considered insane, and the link between stage and
>>>> royalty
>>>> > would
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > be
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > too close for official comfort. Contemporaneously with this
>>>> > Tom Paine
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > was also banned in England and, famously, Coleridge and
>>>> > Wordsworth
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > were watched for talking about Spinoza (Spy-noza)
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > While 'Silas Marner' was banned in Anaheim CA in 1978 (?!)
>>>> and
>>>> > '1984'
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > in Florida in 1981 because it was considered 'pro-communist'
>>>> > (?)
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > --
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > David Bircumshaw
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > Website and A Chide's Alphabet
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.bircumshaw/
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > The Animal Subsides
>>>> > http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> > Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> --
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> "She went out with her paint box, paints the chapel blue
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> She went out with her matches, torched the car-wash too"
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >> The Go-Betweens
>>>> >>>>>>>>> >
>>>> >>>>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>>> --
>>>> >>>>>>>>> My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
>>>> >>>>>>>>> "She went out with her paint box, paints the chapel blue
>>>> >>>>>>>>> She went out with her matches, torched the car-wash too"
>>>> >>>>>>>>> The Go-Betweens
>>>> >>>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>> --
>>>> >>>>>>> My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
>>>> >>>>>>> "She went out with her paint box, paints the chapel blue
>>>> >>>>>>> She went out with her matches, torched the car-wash too"
>>>> >>>>>>> The Go-Betweens
>>>> >>>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>> --
>>>> >>>>>> David Bircumshaw
>>>> >>>>>> Website and A Chide's Alphabet
>>>> > http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.bircumshaw/
>>>> >>>>>> The Animal Subsides
>>>> http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
>>>> >>>>>> Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>> --
>>>> >>>>> My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
>>>> >>>>> "She went out with her paint box, paints the chapel blue
>>>> >>>>> She went out with her matches, torched the car-wash too"
>>>> >>>>> The Go-Betweens
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> --
>>>> >>>> David Bircumshaw
>>>> >>>> Website and A Chide's Alphabet
>>>> > http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.bircumshaw/
>>>> >>>> The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
>>>> >>>> Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> --
>>>> >>> My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
>>>> >>> "She went out with her paint box, paints the chapel blue
>>>> >>> She went out with her matches, torched the car-wash too"
>>>> >>> The Go-Betweens
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> --
>>>> >> David Bircumshaw
>>>> >> Website and A Chide's Alphabet
>>>> > http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.bircumshaw/
>>>> >> The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
>>>> >> Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > --
>>>> > My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
>>>> > "She went out with her paint box, paints the chapel blue
>>>> > She went out with her matches, torched the car-wash too"
>>>> > The Go-Betweens
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
>>>> "She went out with her paint box, paints the chapel blue
>>>> She went out with her matches, torched the car-wash too"
>>>> The Go-Betweens
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Andrew
>>> http://hispirits.blogspot.com/
>>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/aburke/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> David Bircumshaw
>> Website and A Chide's Alphabet http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.bircumshaw/
>> The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
>> Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
>>
>
>
>
> --
> David Bircumshaw
> Website and A Chide's Alphabet http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.bircumshaw/
> The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
> Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
>
--
David Bircumshaw
Website and A Chide's Alphabet http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.bircumshaw/
The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
|