medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
Medieval western ideas of grace probably differ widely from earlier,
especially Greek ones. Most of the 15th and 16th century theologians I
read for the article were not experts on Greek. Their notion of grace
reads, in the Vulgate Latin, as something other than "gifts". Almost as
a quantity. I had thought to find "plena gratia" used to show that Mary
had no obstacles to being full of grace in that sense because she was
free from original sin. I did not find that argument. Of course, I may
be making their concept of grace sound too quantitative, not being a
theologian myself.
Tom Izbicki
Diana Wright wrote:
> medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
>
> Tom Izbicki wrote:
>> medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and
>> culture
>>
>> Paul,
>>
>> I do mean the term. The concept was "in the making" in the twelfth
>> century. Bernard opposed both feast & doctrine - as was noted in a
>> previous message, the former supporting the latter. The term we use
>> is indeed late, but it is not without precedent. The idea of Mary
>> being "sine macula et ruga" existed in the texts I read. One
>> odditty, related to the biblical texts. The fact that Gabriel
>> referred to Mary as "gratia plena" did not show up in the Immaculist
>> arguments. I still find that odd.
>>
>
> I don't know the implications of "gratia plena" in Latin, but the
> Greek is of course, in partial translation, "full of gifts" & the
> reader decides whether they are gifts already given to her and/or
> gifts she has to give. The writer of Luke/Acts was well aware of Greek
> literature, & I suspect he had in the corner of his mind "Pandora"
> which is "all gifts" given to her by the divinities before she was
> shipped down. There is also the irony of the "all gifts" that were
> bestowed when the jar was opened, jar in part representing to the
> Greeks the womb of the first woman......................
>
>
>
> DW
>
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