medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
Right - that's precisely my question. . . if the description in John is accurate (which may be an open question, I dunno) then the there are some issues with
the shroud itself. This, in my mind, creates a separate anomaly: The medievals would certainly have been aware of the inconsistencies between the
Johannine account and the Turin shroud . . . as evidenced by your reference to period painting.
So, why would a forger create something so obviously at variance with the Gospel account, and even more, why would it gain credence?
Oh, wait . . . silly me! I live in Arkansas. We see that sort of thing every day ;-))
Still, I'm curious about several things. Why does John even mention the cloths? I'm wondering if there is something else going on here. . . maybe I need to
drag out some other references. . .
George (increasing inclined to exert some effort)
On Mon, 24 Mar 2008 11:52:33 -0400, Christopher Crockett wrote:
>medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
>From: "George R. Hoelzeman" <[log in to unmask]>
>> In a related vein, how reliable is the description of the burial cloths in
>the Gospel of John
>not an expert on John, obviously, but it occurred to me in your previous post,
>George, that his description of the burial cloths is not particularly
>consistent with the Image on the Shroud:
>20:6 Then Simon Peter came, following him, and went into the tomb; he saw the
>linen cloths lying,
>20:7 and the napkin, which had been on his head, not lying with the linen
>cloths but rolled up in a place by itself.
>clearly, two "cloths," one for the head (i.e., presumably, over the face).
>the fact that the cloths were "in a pile" is (as we see it always portrayed in
>medieval art) evidence of the Resurrection, and has no bearing on the Image on
>the Shroud.
>the Man on the Shroud was, apparently, placed on one end of the spread cloth,
>the other end being folded over the reclining body, from the head down to the
>feet.
>this doesn't preclude the existence of a "napkin" for the face/head, though
>there is no trace of suchlike an object on the Image.
>which is, of course, entirely irrevelent, since any Art Historian worth her
>psalt can see immediately that the Image on the Shroud is just another one of
>your standard, garden-variety 14th c. French Paintings.
>(right, Jim?)
>>and how would 1st cento burial cloths be arranged with head cloth and body
>wrappings?
>who knows?
>not i.
>c
>> On Mon, 24 Mar 2008 09:09:28 -0400, Christopher Crockett wrote:
>>
>> >medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
>>
>> >the BBC programme will, obviously, be close to worthless --even if
>actually
>> >seen in GB.
>>
>> >this page
>>
>> >http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/4210369.stm
>>
>> >explains that the programme is based on a serious scholarly article
>published
>> >in the journal Thermochimica Acta, familiar to us all.
>>
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