Thanks very much Phil- your comments on both the broad and the specific
are very helpful, as always. I think what we call the profile still
needs thought for the very reasons you mention (it's a thin, modular,
partial duck - it only has wings but my goodness they are great wings
for teaching and learning). I won't reply in detail to your points
because I'll just go "Yeah, yeah".
As for my summer, well, it's kinda turning into a Dublin Core Summer:
while I am delighted with the response to our draft profile (it's so
much better than silence), all you clever folks are giving me more and
more work :-)
Keep 'em coming, everyone.
S.
Phil Barker wrote:
> Hello Sarah, hope you're having a wonderful summer. Many thanks to you
> and your colleagues for sharing this, I have a few comments on the
> details of the documents, but first a couple of more general
> observations.
>
> Firstly, I think one of the previous comments or replies mentioned
> that this isn't really an application profile as we know it. Indeed,
> you make this point yourself in the document, but if you call
> something a "thin" duck and then explain that it doesn't walk like a
> duck or quack like a duck then you're probably going to have
> difficulty communicating what the thing really is. I found it useful
> to think of it as a "partial profile", in other words a set of
> elements useful for profiles in a particular context.
>
> Secondly, I think I agree with Andy's comments about the need for an
> entity relationship model to support this work. Not (only) because of
> any distinction between what we might want to say about
> works/expressions/manifestations/items, but because there are a whole
> load of other entities implied in the description: learners,
> qualifications, "contexts" , and I think it would help clarify
> discussion on some elements if we could what they applied to. I think
> your discussion of LOM 5.11 education.language is the simplest case
> where an entity-relation model that included the learner would help
> [language of the resource is not the same as language of the learner
> even if it is described by the same DC element], subject is another,
> see below.
>
> Now the minutiae ...
>
>
> In Functional requirements you say
> "b. Support for Educational Use of Resources
> The DC-Ed AP must support those interested in teaching and learning
> (primarily educational practitioners but possibly others) in
> determining a resource's potential for use within a given educational
> setting."
> Is it really the intention to concentrate so specifically on the needs
> of teachers (if that is what you mean by educational practitioners)
> not learners or parents? it seems a strange limitation in scope for
> work at this level. What are the consequences of this?
>
>
> In the intro, you say
> "The exception to the focus on educational properties is for Subject
> and Type, where the AP intends to suggest vocabularies of specific use
> for educational materials." which struck me as odd at first. Then I
> read the element definition table where you suggest subject might
> describe "A reference to a standard for curriculum, competency or
> learning objective to which the resource conforms." So LOM 9
> Classification with 9.1 Classification.Purpose = educational objective
> and 9.1 Classification.Purpose = competency would be relevant. I'm
> inclined to think that this is different to (or perhaps a significant
> refinement of) subject. Seems like DC:relation with conformsTo
> refinement is better place for references to such standards. Which
> makes me think that this is one of the cases where an entity
> relationship model might be useful: your not describing the resource
> per se, you're describing the course the student might be on -- that
> relationship, not the subject attribute, is education specific.
>
> Still on the subject row in that table, the wording "DC-Ed AP to
> recommend vocabularies in use within educational metadata, e.g. Joint
> Academic Coding System (JACS) in the UK." could be taken to mean that
> DCMI will recommend that if you're in UK HE then you should use JACS,
> which is probably not what you mean. It might be better to say "e.g.
> the UK HE Joint Aca...(JACS)"
>
>
>
> In the vocab listings:
> For LTSN Pedagogic terms you give the LTSN resource type vocabulary,
> which is a bit confusing since there was an LTSN pedagogy vocabulary,
> which is now the HE Academy pedagogy vocabulary available at
> http://www.connect.ac.uk/ixbin/hixltp?_IXACTION_=file&_IXFILE_=templates%2Fvocab%2Ftop.html&_IXthes=Pedagogy
>
>
> For the row heading of TLTP vocabularies you talk about the TLRP vocabs.
>
> [and if these came directly from the CETIS pedagogy vocabularies
> report then I'm deeply embarrassed about not spotting them then.]
>
>
> Hope this helps, Phil.
>
> ps. the notes I made as I went along are available at
> http://www.google.com/notebook/public/16007482002381607562/BDQTGQgoQtpbh88Ui?hl=en
> <http://www.google.com/notebook/public/16007482002381607562/BDQTGQgoQtpbh88Ui?hl=en>
>
> which has a little more detail in places.
>
> Sarah Currier wrote:
>> Dear all,
>>
>> The Dublin Core Conference 2007 in Singapore is fast approaching.
>> The next face-to-face meeting of the DC-Ed Community will take place
>> there.
>>
>> Diane Hillmann, Stuart Sutton and I have been working hard to get
>> draft materials related to the proposed DC-Ed Application Profile
>> ready for this meeting. We would like to disseminate the results of
>> this work prior to the meeting so that anyone who can't attend can
>> give feedback and input. We'd be very grateful if you could spend
>> some time having a look and feeding back to us. Discussion on this
>> list is particularly welcome. If you only have time to look at the
>> areas that particularly interest you, that's fine! I have tried to
>> delineate the different areas we'd like feedback on below, to make it
>> easier for you.
>>
>> We now have a wiki page linking to a new draft Application Profile
>> document:
>> http://dublincore.org/educationwiki/Working_20Draft_20of_20DC_2dEd_20Application_20Profile
>>
>>
>> --
>> Sarah Currier
>> Co-Moderator, Dublin Core Education Community
>>
>> Product Manager, Intrallect Ltd.
>> http://www.intrallect.com
>>
>> 2nd Floor, Regent House
>> Blackness Road
>> Linlithgow
>> EH49 7HU
>> United Kingdom
>>
>> Tel: +44 870 234 3933 Mob: +44 (0)7980855801
>> E-mail: [log in to unmask] --
>>
>> --
>> Sarah Currier
>> Product Manager, Intrallect Ltd.
>> http://www.intrallect.com
>>
>> 2nd Floor, Regent House
>> Blackness Road
>> Linlithgow
>> EH49 7HU
>> United Kingdom
>>
>> Tel: +44 870 234 3933 Mob: +44 (0)7980855801
>> E-mail: [log in to unmask] --
--
Sarah Currier
Product Manager, Intrallect Ltd.
http://www.intrallect.com
2nd Floor, Regent House
Blackness Road
Linlithgow
EH49 7HU
United Kingdom
Tel: +44 870 234 3933 Mob: +44 (0)7980855801
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
--
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