My comments inserted below Andrew's paragraphs...
It occurred to me that I might be trying the patience of the other 1500 psci-commers who aren't interested in this so would any of the people who've commented on this topic mind if I excerpted bits of the discussion to my blog (or one of your blogs if it's a bit fancier than mine http://brodiesnotes.blogspot.com) and we chat about it there?
Jo
-----Original Message-----
From: A Robinson [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thu 05/08/2010 12:01
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Capturing useful psci-com information,
Hello,
The advantages of having information easily assessable is that it is
more available to people not on these mailing lists, that it's more
'browseable for people not necessarily looking for an answer to a
specific question' and there isn't repetition on the mailing list.
Jo>> Yes, completely agree - it would be great for it to be googleable. I don't think email content from psci-com appears in Google, you have to visit the mailing list archive and search within the database so people will only find info here if they already know that 'here' exists.<<
I'm trying to get an idea of a specification for what people think
they want from a usability point of view rather than a technological
one. Please comment on if this seems a reasonable summary.
It seems that an email list is the preferred means of discussing
concepts, but with a way to capture and collate responses to make a
more permanent resource. This would allow information to be better
organised and linked together to help other users find what they need.
Currently the way to help people find this info is a) for it to appear
in Google, b) in a site specific search c) in an explorable hierarchy/
taxonomy. However, as busy people, most subscribers haven't got the
time to 'write up' the email threads to another site.
Jo>> Agree - I think whoever originally asks the question *might* like to write up their own thread but anyone who thinks they have something to add should be able to pitch in.<<
The Q and A site makes it easy to group and link information, makes it
easy to search, but it doesn't provide the discussion aspect, nor does
it have the established user base that psci-com@jiscmail has.
In light of this, is what is needed a button on the bottom of each
email that says "record this thread" , which prompts for a few key
words and then copies (the previous questions and the answer) to a Q
and A site -- or increases the 'usefulness rating' of a previously
recorded response?
Jo>> Sounds intriguing, though am not sure how practicable it would be to implement via JISCmail. It would also need to strip out people's email addresses (and quite possibly their name and other contact details). The psci-com archive masks email addresses of course. But off-list replies wouldn't be captured in this way and people may want their personal info to be excluded.<<
Note also that the Q and A site, as it stands, has the option to edit
previous questions and responses in the style of a wiki (that's not
quite as easy and wikispaces, but is still generally nice wysiwyg word
processor style. It also has the facility to add comments.
Jo>> I like this aspect.<<
Alternatively, how about, keeping the discussion list as is and having
a wiki that's as easy to use as wikispaces, with the the ability to
add comments as found in a blog -- perhaps optionally linked to a
paragraph in the wiki, essentially a footnote, with threaded
discussion? Assuming it has tags and search, then effectively it's the
same feature set of a CMS? To me the feature we want from a CMS is
that pages are easy to edit by groups of people, can include text,
images, videos etc. and be cross linked -- potentially within some
organisational structure.
With any solution it's the same as any psci-com activity the key is in
'engaging the audience' -- in this case, engaging the psci-commers to
contribute and I'm not sure best how to do that. I strongly feel it
shouldn' t be technology that dictates. It's just a same the
technology doesn't exist to automatically extract info from mailing
lists.
Jo>> I like wikispaces myself but happy to learn more about Drupal. A while back I added some information collected from psci-com, with info I'd previously collected (http://brodiesnotes.blogspot.com/2010/02/graphic-design-and-picture-resources.html about photos / graphics etc) to a page on my own blog. People often blog about answers they've received to questions, my idea is to get Qs&As (including non-list responses) about science communication things in one place.<<
Perhaps we don't need anything -- although the comment about repeating
ourselves was made, how much of a problem is this? Is it worth the
effort of essentially getting a mechanism for publishing information,
just so some people are able to browse it and people don't repeat
ourselves? Should we just be getting everyone interested to join a
mailing list and answer their questions and where necessary post a web
link back to the JISCmail archives?
Jo>> I haven't noticed a huge amount of repetition and with new people joining and leaving I'm sure the info is refreshed when a question is asked again. It's just that the answers don't get a chance to do very much beyond answer the immediate question.
As I've been writing this it struck me that I'm trying to do with answers what I've actually been doing with science communication job descriptions - trap them while they're 'open' so that they can be accessed even when the job has closed http://scicommjobs.posterous.com<<
Andrew
On 4 Aug 2010, at 22:05, Jo Brodie wrote:
>
> I'd much rather people ask questions here and, as often happens,
> someone will anonymise (some people prefer to reply off-list),
> collate and share the responses with the list - it's at this point
> that *I* think we could do more to capture (and share more widely)
> the information... but I'm not sure what.
>
> It would probably be helpful to have something on which you can add
> extra information in the future, to keep the pages updated - a blog
> style of thing with comments might work well if Wikispaces looks
> unstable and other wikis are impenetrable.
>
> Could a portion of the parent pscicom website at Intute be reserved
> for user editing or not possible? http://www.intute.ac.uk/pscicom/
>
> Having said that I do like Andrew's website - but I probably
> wouldn't go there first to ask a question of the science community
> posse. I'd come here or go to BIG-chat, ABSW-L, Stempra etc. But
> maybe the format could work if people were encouraged to ask
> questions HERE and post collated responses here and at Andrew's
> site...
>
> Anyway I managed to find the email I wrote back in December where I
> raised the idea of a content-management system. This link might take
> you there https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A2=PSCI-COM;VtrCuQ;200912071541370000
> but assuming it doesn't work have a search of the archives for
> "Some sort of 'content management' type of system?" from me on Mon 7
> Dec 2009 https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A0=psci-com.
> I'm afraid I can't remember if there was much enthusiasm for it then
> either.
>
> Jo 'forgetfully repeating myself, forgetfully repeating myself' Brodie
> P.S. Maybe we should have a psci-com hackday where we lock some
> nerds in a room with wifi, pizza and beverages and see what they can
> come up with :)
>
> Science Information Officer
> Library and Information Team http://www.diabetes.org.uk/library
> Diabetes UK (Mondays, Tuesdays and Fridays)
>
> On Wednesdays and Thursdays I work on a separate project at UCL
> Public Engagement Coordinator
> CHI+MED project http://tinyurl.com/CHI-MEDproject
> UCL Interaction Centre, UCL.
>
> Get Serious - just add your name and email address to show your
> support at
> http://www.diabetes.org.uk/GetSerious
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: A Robinson [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wed 04/08/2010 15:00
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Capturing useful psci-com information,
>
> As an addition, or an alternative to a wiki how about a question and
> answer site? I have created a test example at
>
> http://hutch.cs.man.ac.uk/
>
> Similarly, please feel free to try it. You can either register for an
> account or sign in via twitter. I hope to add sign in through facebook
> once the appropriate part of facebook starts working again.
>
> Wikispaces.com looks a lot easier to use than many other wikis.
> Unfortunately it looks like it's locked into one particular company
> that may begin charging (which apparently Ning have started doing) or
> go bust. An open source wiki with the same usability of wikispaces
> would be better then we're not tied into a particular company -- if
> anyone knows of one?
>
> Andrew
>
> Dr Andrew Robinson
> University of Manchester
>
>
>
> On 3 Aug 2010, at 23:12, Jo Brodie wrote:
>
>> Interesting ideas coming through - thank you.
>>
>> Although I'm not particularly wedded to the idea of a wiki I thought
>> I should highlight Wikispaces which doesn't use any fancy language.
>> It's basically like using Word (insert preferred text editor here)
>> and I made this with it - feel free to add a page and play around
>> with the editing.
>>
>> http://sciencecommunication.wikispaces.com/
>>
>> It's perhaps not ideal for what I'm suggesting, as it would soon be
>> a chaos of added pages - probably a content management system would
>> be better.
>>
>> I created that earlier this year and promptly forgot about it, as
>> will be abundantly obvious from its half-bakedness!
>>
>> Wouldn't mind if you didn't delete all the pages... but I can't stop
>> you as I've set it to 'anyone can edit' ;-)
>>
>> Jo
>>
>>
>>
>> On 3 Aug 2010, at 17:22, "Jon Manning" <[log in to unmask]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> It's my experience that most non-technical users are extremely
>>> averse to wiki syntax- as I understand the term 'wiki'. Some of the
>>> more geek-centric groups I work with are happy with the idea, but
>>> others click edit, see that markup, and never come back.
>>>
>>> I get on very well with content management systems such as Drupal-
>>> you can implement all kinds of functionality and have it all in one
>>> place. Users can edit pages more easily, and they get a 'wysiwyg'
>>> interface with Word-like features they're familiar with. Plus the
>>> available plugins make available features you might not have
>>> thought of.
>>>
>>> Jon
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> A Robinson wrote:
>>>> Hello,
>>>>
>>>> On the subject of sharing, I've been trying to design a mechanism
>>>> for Science Communication here in Manchester, but there's nothing
>>>> to stop it being a national thing too.
>>>> So far the thinking is a mailing list, yahoo answers style Q&A,
>>>> wiki combination. -- We've looked around and can't find anything
>>>> that seems to solve the problem.
>>>>
>>>> Anyone else got any experiences, online sites for this sort of
>>>> thing that they particularly like? How do people feel about a wiki?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dr Andrew Robinson
>>>> University of Manchester
>>>>
>>>> On 3 Aug 2010, at 16:45, Jo Brodie wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello all
>>>>>
>>>>> *1. Capturing useful psci-com information*
>>>>>
>>>>> Re: [PSCI-COM] Copyright and use of video clips in education
>>>>> sessions
>>>>>
>>>>> This sounds very useful Ruth, thanks for sharing.
>>>>>
>>>>> Do we capture this sort of information somewhere? I know it's
>>>>> searchable over at jiscmail.ac.uk but it seems like we could make
>>>>> it a bit easier to find. I seem to remember suggesting some sort
>>>>> of wiki-type of thing a while back but I'm afraid I've forgotten
>>>>> what was agreed, if anything - oops. Having said that I certainly
>>>>> don't want to give myself, or anyone else, any more work to do.
>>>>>
>>>>> I currently have my 'Sharepoint intranet trainer's' head on at
>>>>> work so am seeing everything as 'content' to be captured at the
>>>>> moment ;-)
>
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