medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
From: Robert Kraft <[log in to unmask]>
> How early are liturgical "rotuli" attested, with the running combination
of text and images (often with the images upside-down in relation to the
text, so that the picture hangs over the lectern and is visible to the
hearers while the reader presents the accompanying text)? The ones I've
seen tend to be later, but I don't know if that is significant.
as far as i'm aware (which ain't far at all) the survivors are Italian (only?)
and might not go back before c. 11, but that doesn't mean the technique wasn't
used elsewhere and before that, of of course.
but if our text is referring to such "teaching aids" --which was my original
thought, based more on an over-active imagination than any actual knowledge of
the Latin language-- then the proposal put forward by Cyprian (and seconded by
Grover) that it is a question of "The Bishop...training the young men in
skills [reading, writing, and painting] that will be of use...to the church
and for clerical life."
but, will the text itself support such an interpretation?
here it is again:
Iuvenes quoque et pueros quos...sapidos invenit [the Bishop], per diversa
scolarum studia cirucumquaque dispertivit; quorum certe postea servimine
variam ac multiplicem suae ecclesiae utilitatem **in lectione scriptura et
pictura** ac plurali honestiori clericalis officii disciplina conquisivit.
i.e., can "in lectione[,] scriptura et pictura" be read as "in reading,
writing and painting"??
"...and other disciplines [useful for] clerical offices" ?
c
> Grover Zinn (imap) wrote:
> > medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
> >
> > Looking more carefully at the phrase (and not the question posed) I
> > would agree with you. The Bishop is training the young men in skills
> > that will be of use (see the text) to the church and for clerical
> > life. Reading, writing and painting are indeed useful in those contexts.
> >
> > Still, the relation of texts and "pictures" as a concept is always
> > interesting!
> >
> > best
> >
> > Grover Zinn
> >
> > Grover A. Zinn
> > William H. Danforth Professor of Religion (emeritus)
> > former Associate Dean, College of Arts and Sciences
> > Oberlin College
> > Oberlin, OH 44074
> > 440-775-8866 (department)
> > [log in to unmask]
> >
> >
> > On Jul 24, 2008, at 2:31 PM, Cyprian Rosen wrote:
> >
> >> medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and
> >> culture
> >>
> >> I think he is saying "reading, writing, and painting"
> >>
> >> Cyprian Rosen
> >>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: medieval-religion - Scholarly discussions of medieval religious
> >>> culture [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
> >>> Christopher Crockett
> >>> Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2008 10:57 AM
> >>> To: [log in to unmask]
> >>> Subject: [M-R] 'in lectione...pictura'?
> >>>
> >>> medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and
> >>> culture
> >>>
> >>> i *think* that i know what this text is saying, but am not sure what it
> >>> *means* --perhaps others might have a better idea, which would be
> >>> appreciated.
> >>>
> >>> Otto Lehmann-Brockhaus, in his massive collection of middlevil sources
> >>> referring to "art"
> >>>
> >>> Schriftquellen zur Kunstgeschichte des 11. und 12. Jahrhunderts für
> >>> Deutschland, Lothringen und Italien... Berlin, Deutscher Verein für
> >>> Kunstwissenschaft, 1938
> >>>
> >>> reprints a few lines from the life of Bishop Godehard of Hildesheim
> >>> (1022-38):
> >>>
> >>> [p. 713, #3000]
> >>> Iuvenes quoque et pueros quos...sapidos invenit, per diversa scolarum
> >>> studia
> >>> cirucumquaque dispertivit; quorum certe postea servimine variam ac
> >>> multiplicem
> >>> suae ecclesiae utilitatem **in lectione scriptura et pictura** ac
> >>> plurali
> >>> honestiori clericalis officii disciplina conquisivit.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> i take this to mean that the saintly bishop taught the young (soon-to-
> >>> be)
> >>> clerics under his care (perhaps even including the author of the Vita)
> >>> to
> >>> "read text [/writings, or perhaps, Scripture] and pictures
> >>> [/images]..."
> >>>
> >>> if this reading is at least Ball-Park correct, i don't think i've ever
> >>> come
> >>> across a text which speaks of teaching someone to "read" images before.
> >>>
> >>> am i on the right track?
> >>>
> >>> or is this nothing more than a somewhat pretentious aspiring
> >>> hagiographer
> >>> showing off by playing with the sound of "scriptura et pictura"?
> >>>
> >>> c
> >>>
> >>> **********************************************************************
> >>> To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME
> >>> to: [log in to unmask]
> >>> To send a message to the list, address it to:
> >>> [log in to unmask]
> >>> To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion
> >>> to: [log in to unmask]
> >>> In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to:
> >>> [log in to unmask]
> >>> For further information, visit our web site:
> >>> http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html
> >>
> >> **********************************************************************
> >> To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME
> >> to: [log in to unmask]
> >> To send a message to the list, address it to:
> >> [log in to unmask]
> >> To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion
> >> to: [log in to unmask]
> >> In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to:
> >> [log in to unmask]
> >> For further information, visit our web site:
> >> http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html
> >
> > **********************************************************************
> > To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME
> > to: [log in to unmask]
> > To send a message to the list, address it to:
> > [log in to unmask]
> > To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion
> > to: [log in to unmask]
> > In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to:
> > [log in to unmask]
> > For further information, visit our web site:
> > http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html
>
> **********************************************************************
> To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME
> to: [log in to unmask]
> To send a message to the list, address it to:
> [log in to unmask]
> To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion
> to: [log in to unmask]
> In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to:
> [log in to unmask]
> For further information, visit our web site:
> http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html
>
**********************************************************************
To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME
to: [log in to unmask]
To send a message to the list, address it to:
[log in to unmask]
To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion
to: [log in to unmask]
In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to:
[log in to unmask]
For further information, visit our web site:
http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html
|