Nicky, Daniella has rightly questioned the use of the dogwhelks at your
Mesolithic site for dye production but in reply to your query about
crushing shells, and extraction of animals to get at the toxin which is
stored in a white vein or reservoir near the head, one animal yields a
minute amount. In the literature on the production of Tyrian purple, it
is often stated how very many snails would be needed for a usable
amount. For example, Lovell (Edible British Molluscs) reviews this and
the technique involved, p. 200 onwards. He says "The shell, which is
very hard, is broken by a smart blow, taking care not to crush the body
of the fish (sic) within". It is difficult to imagine the refined
dyestuff that is procured being produced if the animals are simply
crushed and used in toto.
I didn't see Ken's reply to you - did this go out to Zooarch globally?
Jan
In message <[log in to unmask]>, Nicky Milner
<[log in to unmask]> writes
>Dear all
>
>thanks for the answers to the dogwhelk question. I like the idea of
>hermit crabs perhaps being used for bait, especially as, in response
>to Jans e-mail, many of these shells do appear to be fairly worn and
>not fresh. Also most are complete, that is the apex has not been
>broken off to extract the dogwhelk....How would you extract a hermit
>crab? So far we have only had one fragment of mussel so it
>seems unlikely they are being brought in that way.
>
>Re. dying using dogwhelks I would be interested to know how this is
>actually done. I think I had read somewhere that crushed dogwhelks
>had been found on some Irish sites indicating dyeing. Would crushing
>not release the dyestuff anyway? Why does the animal have to be
>extracted?
>
>Ken,
>only 6 topshells have been found so far but we've only really started
>digging the features. There is a huge amount of animal action going
>on and so a lot of the shells and flintwork came up in the topsoil
>and subsoil and so I can't even be positive that all of the shells
>are actually contemporary with the site though they do seem to only
>appear with the lithics and above the underlying archaeology - we
>will be investigating this further. However, there are some shells
>which have come from stratified deposits. 5 of the topshells are from
>either unstratified deposits or topsoil but there is one from
>occupation debris within what we think is a structure and this has
>been dated by AMS on charred hazlenut to 9th millenium bp. I can't be
>sure about the species,....it might be Gibbula cineraria but I'm not
>sure. Don't know if that helps?
>If you do come across the ethno example of eating dogwhelks I would
>be interested
>Many thanks
>nicky
>
>
>> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 13:20:22 +0100
>> Reply-to: [log in to unmask]
>> From: Tony Legge <[log in to unmask]>
>> Organization: Birkbeck College
>> Subject: Re: dogwhelks
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>
>> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>> --------------B9D6A50B7A649B9F0BC15895
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
>>
>>
>> Dear All,
>>
>> Good point about hermit crabs living in dog whelks -
>> these crabs are a favourite sea angling bait for
>> line fisherman and I have taken lots of good cod on
>> these. Of course, we all know that an interest in
>> animal bones is a thin veneer to conceal a much
>> deeper interest in gastronomy. On other matters of
>> traditional food, I notice that the remainder
>> bookshops in UK have cheap paperback copies of two
>> essential books:
>>
>> Dorothy Hartley "Food in England" (London,
>> MacDonald and James 1979) - one of my favourite
>> books.
>>
>> Jack Drummond and Anne Wilbraham "The Englishman's
>> food: five centuries of English diet" (London,
>> Pimlico 1991)
>>
>> Another which is an indispensable read is the much
>> more recent Alan Davidson "The Oxford Companion to
>> Food"
>> (Oxford, OUP 1999).
>>
>> I haven't yet seen the new "Cambridge World History
>> of Food," but at #95 I promise to write a favourable
>> review in exchange for a free copy for any journal.
>>
>> Tony Legge
>> --------------B9D6A50B7A649B9F0BC15895
>> Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii;
>> name="ubzm003.vcf"
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>> Content-Description: Card for Tony Legge
>> Content-Disposition: attachment;
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>>
>> begin:vcard
>> n:Legge;Anthony
>> x-mozilla-html:TRUE
>> org:University of London,;Birkbeck College
>> version:2.1
>> email;internet:[log in to unmask]
>> title:Professor of Environmental Archaeology
>> adr;quoted-printable:;;26 Russell Square,=0D=0ALondon WC1B 5DQ;;;;
>> x-mozilla-cpt:;-1
>> fn:Anthony Legge
>> end:vcard
>>
>> --------------B9D6A50B7A649B9F0BC15895--
>>
>Dr Nicky Milner
>Sir James Knott Research Fellow
>Dept. of Archaeology
>University of Newcastle
>Newcastle-upon-Tyne
>NE1 7RU
>0191 222 5754 (office)
--
Janice Light
88 Peperharow Road
Godalming Surrey
GU7 2PN, UK
Tel: +44 (0)1483 417782
Mob: 0973 322681
email: [log in to unmask]
Carbonate Group, Dept of Geology
Royal Holloway University of London
Egham, Surrey, TW20 0EX, UK
email: [log in to unmask]
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