At 09:01 1/16/99 EST, you wrote:
>....I think Descartes would have had little difficulty in telling us what
>'science' deals with. He would say 'science' deals with the physical side of
>existence, leaving only the 'spiritual' and 'mental' outside its scope....
>John van Wyhe

Having heard from Descartes and van Wyhe, the time is opportune to 
poll some other thinkers:

"To record nothing unclear in this research, we built an instrument by
which we could observe as accurately as possible how much and by how great
a distance from the zenith on the great circle through the moon  and the
horizon's poles the moon displays a parallax" Almagest, Book V, Chap 12,
Ptolemy.
(Astronomy, as an observational science)

"An iron wire passed through a suitable piece of cork, or a needle poised
on a point or mariner's compass, is set in motion when a lodestone is
brought near it..."  De Magnete...Book II, Chap 16, Gilbert.
(Geomagneticism, observed with a model)

"Simplicio: ...this would be the proper moment to introduce one of those
experiments - and there are many of them, I understand - which illustrate
in several ways the conclusions reached.
Salviati: The request which you, as a man of science make, is a very
reasonable one..." 
The Two New Sciences, Third Day, theorem 1, proposition 1, corollary 1,
Galileo
(Experimental Mechanics)

"As we are about to discuss the motion, action, and use of the heart and
arteries, it is imperitive on us first to state what has been thought of
these things by others in their writings, and what has been held by the
vulgar and by tradition, in order that what is true may be confirmed, and
what is false set right by dissection, multiplied by experience, and
accurate observation." An Anatomical Disquisition... Chapter 1    Harvey
(Experimental anatomy)

I should terminate this grand tour of a thread respecting experimental
verification in science which reaches us from two thousand years of
scientific thought with a final rejoinder from another Cambridge scholar:

"Now although it be true, and I know it well, that there is an intercourse
between causes and effects, so as both these knowledges, speculative and
operative, have a great connection between themselves yet because all true
and fruitful natural philosophy hath a double  scale or ladder, ascendent
and descendent, ascending from experiments to the invention of causes, and
descending from causes to the invention of new experiments..." 
Advancement of Learning, Book 2, Chap VII, para 1      Bacon.
(general epistemology)

I will however forebear to quote from Descartes  (who held he created a new
science from consideration of the elements of arithmetic and geometry) on the
grounds that Math as a science is to some extent still controversial.

 Moreover, despite John's claim that Descartes excluded only the spiritual
from the purview of science, Renartus was in fact able to come to firm
conclusions as to the existance of God based on his mathematical and
logical considerations....

Brian




brian whatcott <[log in to unmask]>
Altus OK


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