Dear Louise and Ursula and Britta (and all).
Louise:
"*That human exceptionalism (or anthropocentrism) is a key reason for the
current devastation of the ecosphere*", So true and so sad.
Ursula:
I am very fond of conversation and I stand for a careful relational account
of anything, expressed calmly in every circumstance, and whatever be the
interlocutors, and I have enjoyed your contributions and I learn a lot from
them.
Britta:
"*A good day to be honouring both Haraway and Mead as there is a distinct
lack of female voices in these discussions so I feel building affinity is
of upmost importance to the language of "sustainability". Their work is
invaluable*" I sympathize with that!
A great Sunday to all of you
On Sun, Mar 8, 2020 at 2:57 PM Louise St. Pierre <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> Dear All,
>
> Ursula, I want to tell you that I was very inspired by your work when I
> first discovered it in 2001. I still have a tattered photocopy that I made
> of one of your short texts-- an exchange student brought it to me from
> Europe! After this I purchased and read many of your books. You have done
> so much important work in this field.
>
> Paul, I wonder if your terms are misleading. 'Humanity-Centred' and all
> the other keywords you listed sound to me like status quo, or even
> regressive, given the knowledge that human exceptionalism (or
> anthropocentrism) is a key reason for the current devastation of the
> ecosphere. Yet you write like someone who has a strong passion to make a
> difference, to make a radical contribution to planetary health. Maybe
> revisiting your terminology would help others understand you better?
>
> Sincerely,
> Louise St. Pierre
> www.okala.net <http://www.okala.net/>
>
> https://www.routledge.com/Design-and-Nature-A-Partnership-1st-Edition/Fletcher-St-Pierre-Tham/p/book/9780815362746
> <
> https://www.routledge.com/Design-and-Nature-A-Partnership-1st-Edition/Fletcher-St-Pierre-Tham/p/book/9780815362746
> >
>
> Louise St. Pierre DESIS Lab Coordinator, Associate Professor, Faculty of
> Design and Dynamic Media
> tel 604 630 7425
> Emily Carr University of Art + Design <http://www.ecuad.ca/>
> 520 East 1st Avenue, Vancouver BC Canada V5T 0H2
> This message composed on the unceded traditional territories of the Coast
> Salish peoples of the Səlil̓wətaɬ (Tsleil-Waututh), Skwxwú7mesh (Squamish),
> and xʷməθkwəy̓əm (Musqueam), Nations.
>
> > On Mar 8, 2020, at 8:37 AM, Paul Russell <[log in to unmask]
> <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
> >
> > Dear Ursula,
> >
> > Once again, I have not stated that the concept of 'sustainable design'
> is new. I stated that an explicit focus on the social and human elements of
> sustainability specifically in design literature is much newer than design
> for envirinmental sustainability. Citing UN reports, which are not
> specifically design literature, does not disprove that point. You may have
> mentioned the issue in passing 19 years ago but Bhamra and Lofthouse in
> 2007 were some of the first to talk explicitly and more in-depth about the
> subject and to encourage it to be part of discussing sustainable design and
> are cited as the most important source for that in most of the literature
> thereon. The late 2000s were not "many decades ago". I am still waiting for
> sources specifically in the design literature discussing this in any level
> of depth that are older than the late 2000s (e.g. Bhamra & Lofthouse in
> 2007). It seems like you're offended that the emergence of this area of
> theory isn't attributed to you but I agree with the literature that defines
> this as the starting point.
> >
> > To address the rest of your message;
> >
> > 'Sustainable Development' was defined in 1987 after the Bruntland
> Report, not 1992, and was explicitly about Humanitarian Development, not
> Product Design. If you're claiming that UN reports were instantaneously
> appropriated to the theory and practice of Product Design back in the 1980s
> then that's an interesting claim. I'm not old enough to deny that, but the
> literature doesn't support the claim. The aspect of Sustainable Development
> in the Bruntland Report which refers to meeting basic human needs could be
> argued as the very foundational level of "Social Sustainability", but is a
> million miles away from the understanding and application of the concept in
> research and practice today.
> >
> > Futhermore, the Bruntland Report was written to address 'The Limits to
> Growth' which was specifically about environmental sustainability, and not
> about social sustainability. Hence the Bruntland Report also is mostly
> focused on environmental sustainability, and not about social
> sustainability. Social and cultural elements of Humanitarian Development
> (again, this is not Design literature) were only explicitly addressed by
> the UN for the first time in 1995 in the 'Report of the World Commission on
> Culture and Development'. Victor Margolin did discuss this in relation to
> Design the following year, but of course access to journals was much more
> limited then (no digitalisation, etc.) so to pretend it was instantaneously
> appropriated and used in mainstream use of the term 'Design for
> Sustainability' is another interesting claim. The world doesn't move quite
> that fast today, let alone 25 years ago.
> >
> > In closing, 'Design for sustainability', is a only a fraction of the
> wider issue being discussed. What I was proposing for 'Humanity-Centred
> Design' or whatever the term is called would be more like;
> > Sustainable Design + Universal Design + Humanitarian Design + Positive
> Design + Design for Wellbeing, and more.
> >
> > If you think that "that is just Sustainable Design" then I disagree. I
> will try to obtain a copy of your 2001 book but it does not seem to be easy
> to obtain.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Paul Russell
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: PhD-Design - This list is for discussion of PhD studies and
> related research in <[log in to unmask] <mailto:
> [log in to unmask]>> on behalf of econcept.org <
> http://econcept.org/> <[log in to unmask] <mailto:
> [log in to unmask]>>
> > Sent: Sunday, March 8, 2020 12:05:28 PM
> > To: [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]> <
> [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>>
> > Subject: Re: response to Paul Russel no. 2
> >
> > Dear Paul,
> >
> > I am sorry again but for me as someone who indeed has been at the
> forefront of establishing theory, methods and tools and practice of design
> for sustainability from 1992 on, when sustainable development was
> officially defined by the UN, it is hard to believe that someone else who
> is diving into these topics much later wants to claim that this is a
> rather recent field.
> >
> > It is not.
> >
> > From mid 1995 on designers were discussing it and it includes the larger
> focus that you described as designing for humanity instead of human
> centered design - and more.
> >
> > As you wrote yourself: even before that others were working on social
> and ethical and environmental responsibility and benefits of design they
> just did not use the term sustainable.
> >
> > So maybe you should do a more thorough literature research, that should
> be part of any thorough academic research.
> >
> > I will leave it here and leave this discussion.
> >
> > best ...
> >
> > Ursula
> >
> >> Am 08.03.2020 um 01:00 schrieb PHD-DESIGN automatic digest system <
> [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>>:
> >>
> >> There is 1 message totaling 222 lines in this issue.
> >>
> >> Topics of the day:
> >>
> >> 1. response to Paul Russel on Design for Sustainability
> >>
> >>
> >> -----------------------------------------------------------------
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> >
> >> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2020 00:48:53 +0000
> >> From: Paul Russell <[log in to unmask] <mailto:
> [log in to unmask]>>
> >> Subject: Re: response to Paul Russel on Design for Sustainability
> >>
> >> Dear Ursula,
> >>
> >> Telling someone to "just Google something" implies such a level of
> ignorance of a subject that they could "just Google it" to educate
> themselves. I'm not ignorant of the sustainability literature, which is
> only a small part of the bigger point being made anyway.
> >>
> >> I will check your 2001 source later, but it is exactly Bhamra and
> Lofthouse, 2007 that I was referring to when I said it was the mid-late
> 2000s that was the turning point for when sustainable design is considered
> to contain the social element. It is the source cited for that point in the
> literature thereon also, e.g. the paper link I posted, so not just my
> opinion. I have no desire to get into a semantic debate but I don't think
> 13 years classifies as "many decades" personally.
> >>
> >>
> >> D4S at Delft was published and disseminated in 2009 too, not 2005. Even
> more recently than Bhamra and Lofthouse, 2007.
> >>
> >>
> >> This is really all quite irrelevant though, it's a small part of a
> bigger point for which there is clearly support for. If you think what I
> proposed is "just sustainable design" then I disagree. It seems others can
> see how it builds on top of that. I've clearly stated in not claiming to
> have devised the elements contained within the concept either - only to
> collate and formalise them. Something which Papanek never did, had he done
> so and communicated it perhaps it would have gathered momentum easier.
> >>
> >> References in your first response would have been appropriate and
> welcomed, rather than being told to Google something. This is an academic
> forum and hence it seems appropriate to write academically in our messages.
> Take this how you will.
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >> Paul Russell
> >>
> >> ________________________________
> >> From: PhD-Design - This list is for discussion of PhD studies and
> related research in <[log in to unmask] <mailto:
> [log in to unmask]>> on behalf of Ursula Tischner <
> [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>>
> >> Sent: Friday, 6 March 2020, 23:36
> >> To: [log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> >> Subject: response to Paul Russel on Design for Sustainability
> >>
> >> OMG Paul,
> >>
> >> I am sorry that you feel insulted, but I just suggested to google the
> term because there is so much good literature about it out there and some
> of it dates back a couple pf decades.
> >> So yes, it is actually an „old“ term and a long standing field of
> research and practice….
> >>
> >> E.G. my design agency : econcept agency for sustainable design was
> founded in 1996….
> >>
> >> Here a couple of literature suggestions for you in chronological order:
> >>
> >> Tischner, U./ Charter, M. (Hrsg.) (2001): Sustainable Solutions,
> U.Tischner, M. Charter (Hrsg.), Greenleaf Publishing, Sheffield
> >> In this book we wrote for instance:
> >> Sustainable Product Design is more than eco-design
> >>
> >> At present, where sustainability is considered in product development
> and design, it is typically regarded as the same as eco-design. But
> Sustainable Product Design (SPD) is more than eco-design, as it integrates
> social and ethical aspects of the product’s life cycle alongside
> environmental and economic considerations – aiming for the so called
> ‘triple bottom line’.
> >>
> >> And we defined Design for Sustainability in the simplest sense as being
> good for the planet good for people (as many people as possible) and
> creating value for as many people as possible. So it combines
> environmental socio-cultural and economic dimensions in the design
> briefings and in the design activities. It seeks to develop sustainable
> solutions following the UN definition of sustainability..
> >>
> >> That was back in 2000 = 20 years ago and we were not the first talking/
> writing about this…
> >>
> >> Later books that I recommend are e.g.:
> >>
> >> Design for Sustainability TU Deft and others for UNEP, especially for
> developing country perspective, 2005
> >>
> https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.d4s-de.org%2Fmanual%2Fd4stotalmanual.pdf&data=02%7C01%7C%7C062083dc014f455fe33208d7c3590c1b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637192659526968580&sdata=5fTErsXtlxPlBxLzq6zwWyYy6IfRQShVDBc1aBH%2FY7U%3D&reserved=0
> <
> https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.d4s-de.org%2Fmanual%2Fd4stotalmanual.pdf&data=02%7C01%7C%7C062083dc014f455fe33208d7c3590c1b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637192659526968580&sdata=5fTErsXtlxPlBxLzq6zwWyYy6IfRQShVDBc1aBH%2FY7U%3D&reserved=0
> >
> >>
> >> Design for Sustainability: A Practical Approach
> >> Tracy Bhamra, Vicky Lofthouse, Gower Publishing, Ltd., 2007
> >>
> >> The Handbook of Design for Sustainability by Stewart Walker et al 2013
> >>
> https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.bloomsbury.com%2Fuk%2Fthe-handbook-of-design-for-sustainability-9780857858528%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C062083dc014f455fe33208d7c3590c1b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637192659526978592&sdata=mdVa%2F%2FIcoCFJdZ6dyrvZCNHQ%2B8rk%2FuAc1B1CiZlNTd8%3D&reserved=0
> >>
> >> Stebbing and Tischner, Changing paradigms, designing for a Sustainable
> Future, cumulus think tank publication, 2015
> >> download here:
> https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cumulusassociation.org%2Fchanging-paradigms-designing-for-a-sustainable-future%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C062083dc014f455fe33208d7c3590c1b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637192659526978592&sdata=gD6WcyGVPmtsaYca%2F74m07znuUBrtTs0veC%2FkhF5veY%3D&reserved=0
> >>
> >> I hope that helps…
> >>
> >> Best regards
> >>
> >> Ursula Tischner
> >>
> >> CEO
> >> econcept, Agentur für nachhaltiges Design
> >> Albatrosweg 11, 50259 Pulheim
> >> Tel.: +49-(0)151-22650776
> >> [log in to unmask]
> >>
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> >>
> >> und
> >>
> >> Master Eco-innovative Design
> >> Institute of Product & Transportation Design
> >> FH | JOANNEUM Gesellschaft mbH
> >> Alte Poststraße 149, 8020 Graz, Austria
> >> Tel.: +43-(0)316-5453-8119
> >> [log in to unmask]
> >>
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> >>
> >>> Am 06.03.2020 um 01:00 schrieb PHD-DESIGN automatic digest system <
> [log in to unmask]>:
> >>>
> >>> Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2020 08:34:00 +0000
> >>> From: Paul Russell <[log in to unmask] <mailto:
> [log in to unmask]>>
> >>> Subject: Re: PHD-DESIGN Digest - 4 Mar 2020 (#2020-59)
> >>>
> >>> Dear Ursula,
> >>>
> >>> Discussion of Sustainable Design being holistic and covering social
> and human well-being (as well as environmental) is not "many decades old"
> to my knowledge. If you can give some sources for that older than 10-12
> years ago, other than perhaps Papanek who never used the term, that can
> support that claim then please share. Sustainability in general has been
> discussed in those terms for longer, sure. Literature specifically relating
> to design that is explicit in discussing human wellbeing etc. is more
> recent than that, obviously.
> >>>
> >>> What I am proposing goes above and beyond any literature on the more
> holistic Sustainable Design definitions currently available. I haven't
> fully explained it in my email to be succinct and because I'll be
> presenting it later.
> >>>
> >>> I find your suggestion to "just Google it" to be rather insulting
> also. I don't know why you would assume anyone on the list is so ignorant
> of the literature in our field that they would need to "Google it" to
> educate themselves.
> >>>
> >>> Regards,
> >>> Paul Russell
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -----------------------------------------------------------------
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> >> End of PHD-DESIGN Digest - 6 Mar 2020 to 7 Mar 2020 (#2020-62)
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