Ah yes I see your point; I did mention that they get in each other's way, but to better bring it out, I would add that the man probably has very little time left and is about to die. And within that short frame of time, the three chaps, with each their perspective on things and agendas, are getting in each other's way, and struggling to make sure that they achieve their goal at the expense of the other persons'.
But yes I understand what you are saying.
J
-----Original Message-----
From: PhD-Design - This list is for discussion of PhD studies and related research in Design [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Klaus Krippendorff
Sent: Wednesday, 12 December, 2012 5:42 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Wicked Problems
Jude,
Your example is not quite wicked because each of your characters' problems can be solved individually without much interference with each other. You describe three problems, not one.
All problems are defined by particular people or groups. Rittel derived many of his experiences from city planning where many stakeholders (my term) juggle for some influence over what will be decided, binding for all inhabitants.
klaus
-----Original Message-----
Perhaps another possible toy example of a wicked problem. A wicked problem is a problem even at the beginning, at the stage where people cannot even decide what the problem is. In Ken's example, even though it is wicked because there is no consensus, at least the three of them want to watch a movie. But - suppose there on the road side is a man who's been hit by a car, and he's all mangled and can hardly speak. Three persons arrive on the scene: an Irish priest, a doctor and a policeman. What's the problem here? (this is not an irish joke, although it looks like one!) The definition of the problem is problematic, because each of these may have a different sense of a goal and solution. The priest, seeing the miraculous medal hanging around the man's neck, and worried of his imminent death, tries to give him his last and final confession, in case he dies in mortal sin. The doctor rushes over and tries to stem the bleeding, and will not let him die. The police man hovers about, taking pictures and recording clues and tries to see who's at fault. But they get in each other's way. But what's the problem? Each of them I think are after a solution, and are in the midst of realizing each their goals, but each of them have a different definition of what the problem is, and hence it's a wicked problem. Notice also in this example, with each particular definition of the problem is the concomitant judgment about the right solution, which is something Rittel and Weber emphasize. What's the problem? Priest: that man could go to hell if not in the state of grace + I need to absolve him; Doctor: that man could die + I need to stop the bleeding!; policeman: I need to write my report accurately so that the prosecution can secure justice + let me collect evidence.
I agree that fundamentally our normative paradigmatic commitments (preferences) make problems wicked.
Jude
Klaus Krippendorff wrote:
-snip-
i want to reconsider your toy problem:
[Quote from KF post begins] A toy model of a wicked problem is a case in which three friends want to go to a movie. One wants an action film, one wants a weepie, and one wants a light comedy. If neither is willing to change preferences, this is a wickedproblem. If they agree to any kind of solution - two successive coin tosses, a trade-off for the next movie night, a decision to go to a sporting even instead - they dissolve the problem. [Quote from KF post ends]
National Institute of Education (Singapore) http://www.nie.edu.sg
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