medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
From: Jean Luc Deuffic <[log in to unmask]>
> Le copiste du ms de Paris BnF Fr. 256 signe au f. 9v : "Jacquemy Jaurinus"
> http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b84497204/f24.item
yes.
(btw, does the "Jecquemy" seem to you that it has been (partially) erased?)
the .pdf version of the ms. which can be downloaded from Gallica is very
nearly illegible, even at 100% blowup --but, il existe En Principe, so i
suppose that's all that matters.
> Au f. 198v, la "signature" est bien celle de Jean de Berry ...
> http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b84497204/f402.item
sorry, Jean Luc, we seem to be talking past each other here.
my problem may be that i'm coming from the world of 11th-12th c. charters, so
i automatically read that JEHAN monogram the same way that i have read the
monograms of Philip I, his son or grandson.
i.e., as though it were some sort of modern "Ex Libris" book plate, like the
sometimes wonderfully engraved ones which we frequently see in bibliophiles'
books from the 18th-20th centuries --certainly not as a "signature" personally
written by the book's owner .
that is because i have never thought of those sorts monograms as being
"signatures" --primarily because they are always so "perfect", not looking at
all like the work of "Hands-On Monarchs" like the early Capetians (whose
actual _signa_ which i have seen are quite shaky and clumsy).
i'll have to go and actually read what Maurice Prou has to say about the
monograms at the bottom of the charters of Phil I in the introduction to his
magnificent Recueil of that king's Acta
http://www.archive.org/details/recueildesactedd00fran
and see if he is of the opinion that we are actually looking at a [literal]
Royal signature, done in the King's own chubby Hand.
i have to say, such a thought has never occurred to me.
(a devilishly difficult book to find, btw, and a very welcome one to have
on-line.)
i am reading the B.n.'s "Detailed Information" on the ms. (the link in the
upper right corner of the gallica site) as being somewhat amibiguous
"Le manuscrit a fait partie de la librairie du duc de Berry, comme l’atteste
***son*** ex-libris figurant au verso du f. 198 : « Ce livre est au duc de
Berry. – JEHAN »."
i.e., "son" [his] as opposed to "son propre" [his own --"in his own hand"].
hard to believe that a French scholarly text would be ambiguous --deliberately
or otherwise-- but, strange things do happen, from time to time, i suppose.
on the Other hand, a fellow might ask himself, if Jehan Berry were a
reasonably cultured person [duh], why could he *not* have been a [very, very]
skilled Guy who knew how to wield a Plume, and was quite capable of writing
his own Ex Libris inscriptions in his own books, signing them with a
wonderfully ornate and elaborate Monogram of his Own Devising??
i've got to go, and catch a bus home.
i'll have to take a look at Prou, think about it, and resume this discussion
tomorrow.
c
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