Hi Jayne,

I've not heard of this on the self-service but it happened on Millennium Circulation yesterday. Again, it was resolved by closing and re-opening the patron record. I will open a call with Innovative.

Thanks,

Joan.

-----Original Message-----
From: This list is for current and potential users of the Innopac system [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Jayne Pierce
Sent: 14 April 2011 11:19
To: Joan Millington; This list is for current and potential users of the Innopac system
Subject: Re: Fines problem with self-service

Hi Joan
We had the reverse of this happen on our self service in that customers were stopped before they reached their allocation.  We didnt raise a call, as it seemed that if the customer finished the transaction and started again, adding the additional items, it caught up with itself and worked
OK- we put it down to network.  We havent had any reports of it happening lately.

Jayne 

Library ICT Manager
Dorset Library Service
Library HQ
Colliton Park
Dorchester
DT1 1XJ
01305 224442
 



Joan Millington <[log in to unmask]> Sent by: This list is for current and potential users of the Innopac system <[log in to unmask]>
13/04/2011 14:31
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Re: Fines problem with self-service






Hi Everyone,

Interesting to hear about this. 

We have another self-service issue. Probably since Rel 2009B 1.2 (but may be Rel 2009B) students have been able to borrow above our MAX ITEM C limit. We use MAX ITEM C for our main collection. The intermittent fault allows students to borrow e.g. 22 books when they should be limited to 15. 
Anyone else had a similar experience? (We have a call open with Innovative about this).

Best Regards,

Joan.
 
Joan Millington
Systems Librarian
University of Chester
Learning Resources
Parkgate Road
Chester
ENGLAND
CH1 4BJ
 
tel +44 (0) 1244-513324
fax +44 (0) 1244-511300
email [log in to unmask]

-----Original Message-----
From: This list is for current and potential users of the Innopac system [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Emma Hurcombe
Sent: 13 April 2011 12:04
To: Joan Millington; This list is for current and potential users of the Innopac system
Subject: Re: Fines problem with self-service

Hi Matthew,

Thanks for the email, very interesting reading!  I didn't know about this so have just tried it on our machine and got the same result as you.  I don't know whether our students are aware of this or not but will speak to our counter services team to see what they want to do in light of this information.

Regards,
Emma


Emma Hurcombe BA (HONS), PGDip ILM, MA
Systems Specialist (LMS)
Library & Information Services
Aston University
Aston Triangle
Birmingham
B4 7ET
 
Direct dial:     0121 204 4503
Internal dial:   4503
Fax Number:  0121 204 4530
 
Library web page: http://www.aston.ac.uk/lis -----Original Message-----
From: This list is for current and potential users of the Innopac system [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of PHILLIPS M.E.
Sent: 13 April 2011 10:44
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Fines problem with self-service

It has just come to our attention that there is a loophole with respect to overdue books, fines and self-service.  If user A has books overdue, then providing none of them have been recalled or have hold requests, the user can ask a friend, user B, to borrow the books on the self-service machine. 
 The loan will come off A's record and a new loan will be created for user B.  The fines that would have been sue are not accrued on A's record: they just vanish without trace.

I was in the process of reporting this to Innovative when I stumbled across this page:

http://csdirect.iii.com/documentation/sip2.shtml

which includes the following section under "Common problems and frequently asked questions":

--------------------
Blocking checkout of items that are already checked out

If a patron brings an item to a SIP2 selfcheck station and tries to check that item out, Innovative's SIP2 software will permit this checkout. If the item is overdue but not yet billed, the system waives any overdue fines that would be assessed for the patron to whom the item is currently checked out. This behavior is not configurable at this time. Please open a service request if you have additional questions.
--------------------

I opened a service request to ask when they were going to fix it.  The response was that they did not know in which release it was going to be addressed (sounds like it's not on the roadmap) but we could put in an enhancement request.  Alternatively, they could turn off the ability to issue books via self-service that were already checked out, but this would also prevent people renewing via the self-service machines.

The reason we became aware of the problem was that a student mentioned "the loophole" to a member of staff, and when asked what he meant revealed the whole thing!  Of course we have no idea how widespread this knowledge is among the student body, and because Millennium's transaction logging is woefully inadequate we have no way of measuring the financial impact of the loophole.  But more importantly, it's the issue of unfairness, that those "in the know" can routinely get away without paying fines.  This is tempered, admittedly, by the fact that you cannot use this trick if a book is recalled or has hold requests.

I'd be interested to know from other Millennium sites whether you were already aware of this problem, and what decisions you've taken about it:
whether to deny renewal via self-service or to allow the loophole and hope no-one finds out.

Matthew

--
Matthew Phillips
Electronic Systems Librarian, Durham University Durham University Library, Stockton Road, Durham, DH1 3LY
+44 (0)191 334 2941

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