Hi Chris
Thanks for your comments.
As Roland will tell you - I constantly fight the cause for engineering and the fact that it is not a sub-set of science and that it too often ends up less visible than science.
See our response to the original "A Vision for Science and Society" consultation (http://www.raeng.org.uk/societygov/policy/responses/pdf/Scienceandsociety.pdf) in particular:
"The merging, in the Vision, of all scientific-related disciplines under the umbrella term 'science' may be convenient but does little to promote understanding and engagement with the differing nature, outputs and impact of pure science research, applied sciences, engineering and the production of technological products and services."
But in the Science for All report - if we talked about 'science and engineering' - this leaves out technology, social science, health, medicine, mathematics who would also want a specific mention.
So we settled on "the sciences". Is there an alternative? What do we do in such situations when all the different science-related public engagement communities work together?
Although I do argue that science often meets society through technology and engineering so that the default should be public engagement with engineering anyway! Although it gives us another unfortunate acronym.....
You asked why use the terms "researchers and practitioners"?
Because otherwise we resort to using what has become the default (i.e. 'scientists') - which leaves out even more people/ sectors.
What the terms aim to do is include all researchers (scientists; social science researchers; arts and humanities researchers) and practitioners of science (health/ medical practitioners/ engineers/ technologists).
Its not perfect - your thoughts welcome.
Lesley
Dr Lesley Paterson
Head of Public Engagement
The Royal Academy of Engineering
020 7766 0684
*****************************
Ingenious
A grant scheme for creative public engagement with engineering projects. Closing date19th November 2009
-----Original Message-----
From: psci-com: on public engagement with science [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Chris Stokes
Sent: 23 February 2010 16:08
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Does PEST supplant or subsume PUS?
> David Ansell:
>
>I have just been studying my own subconcious prejudice against of the word
> engagement, and I think it is because it has been hijacked (in my mind at
> least) by the present overwhelming fashion for dialog.
>
> Isn't engagement of the public the endpoint which everyone is trying to
> achieve - interested thoughtful, rational, inquisitive, slightly skeptical
> (engaged) people with an understanding of the science and the issues and
> actively learning and applying more science.
In answer to the question here, No! That sounds like an exclusively one-way interpretation of engagement ultimately seeking public accommodation to a sovereign science. I'm much happier with definitions that include dialogue, no matter how trendy "dialogue" may seem. Scientism is thankfully losing its once trendy allure, though not as fast as it might.
I was impressed with how far the definition offered in the Science for All report went towards incorporating dialogue:
'Our vision is of all sections of society valuing the sciences and their methods as creative and empowering ways to ask questions, offer solutions and contribute to our understanding and improvement of the world in which we liveIn practice, this means:
- those involved in the sciences listen to, engage with, and are informed by knowledge and views from the public, leading to increased learning and mutual respect between scientists, the wider society and policy makers
- the science communities are accessible and visible, and there is informed and open communication and debate about the findings, practices, directions and implications of science[.]'
(I was less impressed with the rather strange lumpings and splittings in the report's 'word on definitions', parts of which Lesley has just re-iterated. I'm especially bothered by the use of the word 'science' to include engineering (and apparently with Royal Academy of Engineering approval!). Even if this is excused as a shorthand that saves paper and ink, I'm irked by the way it effectively renders engineering less visible than science per se. And I don't think I even understand the distinction the report makes between science 'researchers' and science 'practitioners' (unless this aligns roughly with the distinction between science as it is usually understood on the one hand (hence SfA-speak: 'researchers'?) and the more practical disciplines of engineering and medicine on the other (hence SfA-speak: 'practitioners'?). Very very confusing, I must say, and right up there on the second substantive page of the report.)
Chris
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