Alex.
True there are plenty of smart and good students around, but most deparments have changed into Cyberspaces. Courses are almost mandatorily given in PowerPoint, samples or specimen are almost extinct and field course are pimarely considered a safety hazzard.
However you may loose faith when "university" administrators want to cut back math and natural science course because those scare away too many students.
Hermann
Sent from my BlackBerry wireless handheld.
-----Original Message-----
From: Alex Chappell <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Mon, 26 May 2008 14:09:02
To:[log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Orthonet, (paper and pencil geology and computer "shortcuts")
I think Mike Sizer has pretty much hit the nail on the head regarding the attitude of students.
His comments remind me of the first time I demonstrated a structural geology course to 2nd year BSc students. On asking why they weren't getting on with the stereonet exercise, something I knew they had all done on courses they had passed in the first year, I was informed that they had previously just followed the instructions given to get the work done and now had no idea how to proceed. They had no interest in understanding what they were doing, which was completely alien to me. None of those students are geologists now. It was the minority of the class, who were there to learn, who didn't need help, or pushing, to get the work done. They are still working in geology today.
The reality is that university geology departments cannot be selective in the students they admit, or they wouldn't exist. Many of the students that are admitted don't have the inclination or ability to learn the basics. I suspect that the number of talented students in the system who can grasp the whole structural geology ethos from pencil and paper field sketches to quantitative computer based work is pretty much the same as ever, but they are less visible amongst the crowds.
Regards,
Alex Chappell
> Date: Sun, 25 May 2008 20:00:07 +0100
> From: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Orthonet
> To: [log in to unmask]
>
> Dear all involved in the Orthonet discussion,
>
> I mean no disrespect to any members of the community.
>
> My name is Mike Sizer and I'm a M.Sc. level student. From my
> viewpoint, the modern technology available and some software developed
> by members of this list have allowed the 'younger' generation to
> 'skip' the more fundimental skills such as plotting steronets and
> generating geological maps. I personally believe that these
> fundimental skills are very important - more important than being able
> to backstrip a basin on a computer!
>
> I would think that 75% of modern B.Sc. level students do not care
> about using there degree - it's an excuse to not work for three years,
> a reason I have personally heard! I would think that the problem lies
> with a higher number of students who are less interested in studying
> geology and more about getting their 'coursework' and 'homework' work
> done quickly - i.e. using a computer and not drawing images first -
> ironic as planning ahead (i.e. drawing) saves time overall.
>
> I know that students are given some leeway by their leacturers, but I
> think that the more experienced members of the community put too much
> faith in the majority of the younger generations! Unless universities
> can become selective about the students they take, there will always
> be the students who will go straight to the computer.
>
> Regards
>
> Mike Sizer
>
>
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