medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
Great thread!
John, as my Latin is rusty and my access to sources even more limited, does
your anthology have other de Vitry sermons directed toward children, or do
you know any references to translated sources? I'd like to read a bit more.
The question rang a little bell in my mind. Riley's _Memorials of London and
London Life_ (p. 580) records the following edict (12 Henry IV A.D. 1411)
from London's Letter Book I, fol. civ:
"That no manere man ne child, of what estate or condicioun that he be, be he
so hardy to wrestell, or make ony wrestliyng, within the Sentiuary ne the
boundes of Poules [Saint Paul's], ne in non other open place within the
Citee of Londone, up<on> peyne of emprisonement of fourty dayes, and making
fyn unto the Chaumbre, after the discrecioun of the Mair and Aldermen."
Of course, it's unclear as to whether the said wrestling took place during
services or whether the church simply provided an ample and tempting venue!
Best from Anchorage,
Dan
____________________________________
Dr. Daniel T. Kline
Associate Professor of English
U of Alaska Anchorage
3211 Providence Drive
Anchorage, Alaska 99508
907-786-4364 | [log in to unmask]
The Electronic Canterbury Tales:
http://afdtk.uaa.alaska.edu/index.htm
"Fortunately, I keep my feathers numbered
for just such an emergency."
-----Original Message-----
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Subject: Re: [M-R] Children in church
medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
In one of his sermons from the 1230s intended for boys/children (pueri) and
talking about how they should learn their prayers, Jacques de Vitry (c.
1180-c. 1240) has this to say about what children should do upon entering a
church. Unfortunately, he doesn't elaborate about how they should behave
during the course of a service. In the legislative and pastoral sources I
know, it is usually godparents who were charged with seeing that their
godchildren learned the basic Christian prayers (Pater noster, Ave, Creed,
sign of the cross). There is some brief anecdotal reference to how Joan of
Arc (who says she learned all her prayers from her mother) acted in church
in the transcripts of her trial. Given that the instructions for behaving
in church for adult lay people don't usually go much beyond stand
reverently, pray what prayers you know, and bow at the elevation of the
Host, I doubt children could be expected to know or do any more than their
parents.
"When you enter God's church, after making the sign of the cross you
should immediately greet the Lord of the house by kneeling before the altar
or the image of the Crucified and giving him thanks, saying, "We adore you,
Christ, and we bless you, for by your holy cross you have redeemed the
world." Say this five times in honor of him who bore the five wounds for us.
And if you don't know how to say this greeting to the crucifix in Latin, say
it in your native language.
"After greeting the Lord of the house, next you should greet the
Lady, kneeling before the image of the Blessed Virgin and saying seven times
the angel's greeting, that is, "Hail Mary, full of grace" in honor of her
who, filled sevenfold with the Spirit, conceived the Son of God. For she is
courtly and kind, and she will return your greeting, perhaps not in words
but in deeds.
"When you have done this, offer your faith to God and say the Creed,
and then any other prayers that God inspires in you."
From Jean Baptiste Cardinal Pitra (ed.), _Analecta Novissima Spicilegii
Solesmensis, Altera Continuatio_, v. 2 (Typis Tusculanis, 1888), pp.
439-442. My translation from my _Medieval Popular Religion: A Reader_.
Best,
John
-------------------------------------------------
John Shinners
Professor of Humanistic Studies
Saint Mary's College
Notre Dame, IN 46556
Office: (574) 284-4494
Fax: (574) 284-4716
----- Original Message -----
From: Chris Daniell <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 7:52 am
Subject: [M-R] Children in church
> medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and
> culture
> Does anyone know articles or accounts of the attitude and presence
> of
> children in church. (I am thinking here of the practicalities of
> children
> in church during services.) As the father of an active 3 year old
> who can
> explore or enjoy playing with toys in the church it struck me that
> I can't
> think of Medieval English examples of people commenting on
> children in
> church. Were children excluded, segregated, ignored or accepted
> and
> tolerated. I suspect the latter but have no examples one way or
> the other.
>
> Chris Daniell
>
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