medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
See below. Someone who knows more about Cistercians in Italy is welcome to jump in.
On Sat, 06 Dec 2003 12:08:36 -0500
Christopher Crockett <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
>
>John Dillon <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>>Christopher Crockett <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>>>i'm just curious, considering the formidable architecture : what was the
>Mother House of San Galgano?
>
>
>> Casamari, it would seem.
>
>
>perhaps i'm wrong and this only applies to France, but my understanding is/was
>that all Cistercian houses traced their lineage back to one of the five(?)
>"Mother Houses" --Citeaux, Clairvaux, Pontigny, and a coupla others i can't
>recall.
La Ferte' and Morimond.
>does this system not apply to Italy?
I believe it did. Casamari was a daughter of Citeaux. So in that sense San Galgano's Cistercian "mother" will also have been Citeaux. I mistook your inquiry to mean "From what house was San Galgano originally peopled (as a Cistercian foundation)?".
>
>>See C(amille) Enlart, "L'abbaye de San Galgano, pres Sienne, au treizieme
>sicle," _Melanges d'archeologie et d'histoire_ 11 (1891), 201-40, esp. pp. 204
>and 210. Enlart's article is based on his examination of the monastery's
>cartulary; it names and conjectures the origins of people employed on the
>abbey's construction.
>
>
>sounds interesting --i.u. doesn't have it, apparently.
That absence could be more apparent than real. A publication of the Ecole française de Rome, it split in 1971 into _Mélanges de l'Ecole française de Rome. Moyen âge, temps modernes_ and _Mélanges de l'école française de Rome. Antiquité_. If IU has either of these, it may well have its predecessor but not an online catalog record for it (in North American libraries, at least, conversion of records to electronic format for journal cataloging was based on records for subscriptions active at or very near the time of conversion, with ceased, cancelled, or otherwise no longer current titles [incl. those replaced in a title change] often not being entered electronically).
>Enlart probably also discusses this question in his slightly later book
>i occasionally see masons and carpenters among the witnesses in 12th c.
>charters in cartularies (and even have a few masons' wives!), but, unless they
>are styled with a toponymic, it's difficult to tell what their "origins" are.
>
>are there, for instance, "French" names among the artisan witnesses in the San
>Galgano cartulary --or are those "people employed on the abbey's construction"
>mentioned in some fashion beyond being simple witnesses ?
>
My admittedly rapid survey of the article caused me to entertain similar reservations. Hence my use of "conjecture" (which I meant as a red flag). E.'s assumption that many of these people were French may have been correct, but his procedure with individual Latin names (e.g., "Bonus"; used by French artisans, so this one too will have been French -- or will probably have been [I was skimming]) struck me as tendentious. And as having been motivated by the same sort of Gaallic nationalism that led one of E.'s contemporaries to assert on an equally tendentious basis that Honorius Augustodunensis' geographic epithet meant that H. was "of Autun".
Best again,
John
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