Dear David and Ken and other members of the list

First, I would like to thank David for his critical comments. I appreciate them, 
as usual and to thank Ken for often taking an initiative to manage the List. 

While David did write - "the idea of 'creativity' will lead you up a cul de sac".
I didn’t interpret it, as Ken did, as suggesting to end the discussion. 
Quite to the contrary, his contribution led me to think it was a call to think critically
on the idea of creativity from a design perspective. 

And David did write "…. I will try and frame the issue as if I was advising a student".
I didn’t think he was being boorish. Again, to the contrary, I thought he was being polite. 
For I took it as a warning sign flagging: ‘I am going to preach, please excuse me’. 

And of course, these are all my subjective interpretations colored by my perception of David. 
I have never personally met David, but I had known his work before I took on doctoral studies. 
I have a great deal of respect for his work and the work from the institute he directs. 
I have also heard many positive things about him from friends who have the fortune to know him. 

Cheers. Spring is coming. Rosan






Ken Friedman <[log in to unmask]> schrieb am 01.03.03 14:01:52:
> 
> Dear David,
> 
> The thread on creativity interests many subscribers to this list.
> There have been some thoughtful ideas posted and some notes have been
> been spot-on. There have also been some problematic ideas put
> forward, including factually inaccurate information on creativity and
> creativity research. I have not yet written write a fully formed note
> on the topic, but your latest post irritates me enough to enter the
> thread on a process issue.
> 
> You are mistaken to write "this is a list about PhDs in design." This
> is not so. The name of this list is an historical contingency. The
> name has not actually defined the list for three years.
> 
> The PhD-Design list was established after the 1998 conference on
> doctoral education in design at Columbus, Ohio. When the focus was
> centered on doctoral education, the list was usually quiet.
> 
> A few months before the conference in La Clusaz, Chris Rust posted a
> thought experiment on the DRS list. Chris's note and the comments of
> his friend, Zeke Conran involved an imaginary attempt by Pablo
> Picasso to earn a Ph.D. This grew into a deep exchange of ideas on
> doctoral education and the thread turned into a significant and
> interesting debate.
> 
> The debate attracted many new subscribers to the DRS list, and the
> volume surprised some long-time subscribers. Preferring their normal
> list volume, some list members suggested that those who wish lengthy
> and robust exchange should find another venue. We agreed that the
> PhD-Design list would become the venue of lengthy exchanges.
> 
> Today, over 900 people around the world subscribe to PhD-Design. It
> has become the largest active discussion list dedicated to design
> research.
> 
> The call to La Clusaz stated that doctoral education in design
> requires attention to several themes. These include philosophies and
> theories of design, foundations and methods of design research, form
> and structure for the doctorate in design, and the relationship
> between practice and research in design. When we moved our
> discussions to PhD-Design, we stated explicitly that PhD-Design
> welcomes debate and dialogue on ALL THESE THEMES.
> 
> These issues are central to doctoral education. They are not limited
> to doctoral education. Neither is the PhD-Design list.
> 
> This list is NOT "a list about PhDs in design." It is a list about
> doctoral education in design AMONG OTHER TOPICS. Any member is free
> to decide what interests him or her. If subscribers do not respond on
> a theme, the topic will yield an empty thread. This is not such a
> case.
> 
> You write, "As this is a list about PhDs in design, I will try and
> frame the issue as if I was advising a student."
> 
> You are not advising students here. You are a member of a forum in
> which the majority of list members are scholars, researchers, and
> professors at a wide range of universities, design schools,
> professional schools, and research institutions.
> 
> It is boorish to lecture a group of distinguished colleagues as
> though you were their doctoral advisor.
> 
> You have posted imaginary advice to doctoral students before. It did
> not seem worth offering a response. When you state that a thread on
> creativity and creativity research is fruitless, you implicitly
> suggest the thread should end. This time, I want to respond.
> 
> PhD-Design has a few, simple ground rules. Any member is free to
> introduce any topic that he or she deems appropriate. Every member is
> free to debate at great length or short, over a few hours or several
> months. Anyone may challenge, respond, or argue. No one is permitted
> to curtail the debate or call for any debate to close.
> 
> This is not the first time you have suggested that a thread be
> closed. This time, I want to state explicitly that this is your view.
> Others do not share your view. If you feel that the thread is too
> abstract, difficult, or problematic, don't participate.
> 
> If you want to say, "I believe this is a silly debate on an
> impossible topic," go ahead and say why. Do not suggest that others
> stop posting on a topic of interest. The last time you did this, it
> seems to me that your complaints about the "spiral of abstraction"
> killed a perfectly viable discussion. I should have taken a stronger
> stand. This time, I will. You have the right to speak for yourself in
> stating that you see this thread as fruitless or overly abstract.
> Other subscribers may not share your view.
> 
> This thread began when David Durling, Rosan Chow, Klaus Krippendorff,
> and others chose to develop it. The notes of the past few days from
> Dick Buchanan, John Feland, Susan Hagan, and Birgit Jevnaker have
> been profound and interesting. The point is not to reach agreement or
> a conclusion. Sometimes people want to know something simply because
> they are curious, eager, or passionate about the questions they ask.
> The point is to examine the topic in a serious and intelligent way.
> 
> Before long, I will offer a few thoughts on this intriguing and
> useful thread. I value the contributions to this thread. I hope that
> those who have taken the time to share their thoughts will continue.
> 
> Yours,
> 
> Ken
> 
> 
> --
> 
> Ken Friedman, Ph.D.
> Associate Professor of Leadership and Strategic Design
> Department of Leadership and Organization
> Norwegian School of Management
> 
> Visiting Professor
> Advanced Research Institute
> School of Art and Design
> Staffordshire University


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