medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
francine nicholson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>From: Christopher Crockett <[log in to unmask]>
>the Book of Kells V&C is itself iconographically related to earlier
>Egyptian examples, I believe.
>Egyptian? I hadn't heard that. I have heard suggestions of influence
from farther east.
*every*thing comes from "farther east" --that's why people Journey there.
as best my memory serves, from a time long ago and a place far, far away, the
Egyptian source (for the *iconography* of the Kells V&C) was/is the Reel
Deal.
though, not for the ridiculous reasons cited here :
http://www.bookofkells.ie/virgin.html --which is something of an embarasement
for a site associated with Trinity College(?), i should think.
"It is said to have been influenced by Oriental and Egyptian art - the pose of
the Virgin is stiff and formal and lacks naturalism."
give me a brake.
i could float the question on the medart list, see what the Prevailing Opinion
is, these daze, but, in *my* time arguements were made based on the position
of the Child viz-a-viz Momma, etc., the kinds of pesky details which
iconographers consider important and dwell on.
now, whether or not there was any *direct* Egyptian=>Kellsian influence
(rather than through intermediaries), that's another question.
but, my memory is that the Opinion was that the influence *was* more or less
direct.
i remember some discussion about a more general connection between Egyptian
hermetical/monastic practice and that practiced out on The Edge.
>>the whole thing is sometimes said to be some kind of perversion of the
Isis/Osiris cult.
>I'm not sure I'd use the word "perversion."
o.k.
"simplification" then.
>I'm aware of suggestions that certain statues and paintings depicting the V&C
are modelled on earlier examples of Isis and Osiris.
well, visually, that seems pretty obvious.
>However, does that mean an entire cultus was modeled on Isis and Osiris?
depends upon what "modeled" means, i suppose.
it *could* be that the later "cultus" sucked itself out of its own fingers, de
novo; but I'd need to see more evidence before accepting that.
leaving aside the (obvious) question of "archtypical" mythologies/imagery as
something of a sticky wicket, the undeniable probability of the continuity
between the *empire-wide* cult of Isis-Osiris => Mary-Child iconographies
(etc.) is, as they say nowadaze, "problematical."
best from here,
christopher
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