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Agree with Nicky.    If you feel useless you don't have much energy to fight the system or join with others.   Perception does matter - aren't all of us in the business of trying to influence minds and hearts one way or another?  Hoping people begin to see things differently?  Fundamentalism in all its guises does not move the world on for either individuals or society.  

 Nicky Hartigan <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> I think if a person starts therapy (CBT or other) feeling useless, and at the end of it no longer feels that way, then that is a good thing. Because if you feel useless (or anything else equally horrible) that is your reality. 
> 
> There are for sure some questionable aspects to all individualistic therapies but they do for some people, some of the time, help things to get better. 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On 8 Aug 2013, at 20:16, Jivan Mohanty <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> 
>> I would agree with Martín-Baró when he says that one cannot be a psychologist (or do psychology) 'without trying to make a contribution toward changing all those conditions that dehumanizes the majority of the population, alienating their consciousness and blocking the development of their historical identity'.  He continues to say that psychology should critically question its activity and its role: 'by whom' is psychology done and 'for what benefit' is it done.  Whilst Baró was specifically referring to Latin American psychology, I believe many of his ideas can apply here in different ways.  
>> 
>> I believe CBT's effect is to adjust individuals to the way of the world without problem posing their subjective experience vis-a-vis the objective and subjective social conditions, of which one may be unemployment as a political and economic tool or part of this particular socio-economic system which is not natural but designed by man.  It is politically important also because it is a cheaper therapy than the alternatives, which raises the question of why this specific cheap therapy is being put in the vanguard of psychological assistance in the US and UK.  
>> 
>> In varying degrees depending on the therapist, I think it limits exploration to the individuals problems, not seeing it in the context of varying social wholes (household, local community, nation, world, etc.).  It divorces the subjective effect of being unemployed (I am feeling useless) from the objective need (I want to uncover and challenge the myths around unemployment for example, and employment for that matter, and want to be actively engaged in reality, trying to transform the objective situation in, and with, the varying social wholes).  It's as if, as long as the person doesn't feel useless, the psychologist's job is done, whereas humans must be way more complex than that: the manifestation of feeling useless resides itself in a whole host of interrelated basic material and psychical needs being unfulfilled.  These are probably not the aims of most CBT practitioners, but I believe that CBT has the aforementioned effect.
>> 
>> 
>> On 8 August 2013 18:15, Nicky Hartigan <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> But surely any psychologist or CBT practitioner is working with people to challenge the assumptions they may be making about having been made unemployed (ie "I've lost my job therefore I am useless") and is certainly not working to suggest that unemployment is not a problem which needs to be addressed by the government and society? 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On 8 Aug 2013, at 17:36, Jivan Mohanty <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> 
>>> Thank you Mike for that reference I will have a look; and I totally agree Penny.  Having experienced only 4 group-sessions (not going for the remaining 2) of CBT around a year and a half ago I knew something was off with its very foundations.  I am struggling to figure out how to approach the all pervasive advocacy and practice of CBT, not only in the welfare function of my University, but peers of mine.  It's so frustrating because the people who advocate it are 'experts' and the peers who support it, support it exactly because it is advocated by 'experts' who are 'evidence-based', whatever that means.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 8 August 2013 15:15, pennypriest <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>> But that idea, about CBT being based not on events themselves but our interpretation of events, is precisely the very foundation of CBT. So it's not just BBC reporting which is the problem, but CBT itself...which has obviously been said many times.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 2013-08-08 14:46, Michael Walton wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I just read the article myself and I share your concern. I'm
>>> especially worried by "CBT is based on the idea that problems aren't
>>> caused by situations themselves, but by how we interpret them in our
>>> thoughts". This sentence alone is blaming the victim, and suggests
>>> that situational factors do not matter. If an individual were
>>> depressed because they were unemployed, helping them to reinterpret
>>> their job hunt could help, but it won't improve the economy, make more
>>> jobs or remove the competition.
>>> 
>>> Have you read much on critical health psychology? The area has some
>>> interesting critical view points on 'mainstream' psychology.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> On 8 Aug 2013, at 10:26, Jivan Mohanty <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>> 
>>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/0/23590545
>>> 
>>> Is anyone at least in the slightest perturbed by the BBC's article above, and general orientation towards psychology, that uncritically advocates CBT?  I don't even know who authored this article.  How to even begin combatting this one-dimensional view of therapy that is being made/has been made hegemonic by the BBC and other news outlets?
>>> 
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>>> ___________________________________ There is a twitter feed: http://twitter.com/CommPsychUK (to post contact Grant [log in to unmask] To unsubscribe or to change your details on this COMMUNITYPSYCHUK list, visit the website: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A0=COMMUNITYPSYCHUK
>> 
>> ___________________________________ There is a twitter feed: http://twitter.com/CommPsychUK (to post contact Grant [log in to unmask] To unsubscribe or to change your details on this COMMUNITYPSYCHUK list, visit the website: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A0=COMMUNITYPSYCHUK
>> 
>> ___________________________________ There is a twitter feed: http://twitter.com/CommPsychUK (to post contact Grant [log in to unmask] To unsubscribe or to change your details on this COMMUNITYPSYCHUK list, visit the website: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A0=COMMUNITYPSYCHUK
> ___________________________________ There is a twitter feed: http://twitter.com/CommPsychUK (to post contact Grant [log in to unmask] To unsubscribe or to change your details on this COMMUNITYPSYCHUK list, visit the website: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A0=COMMUNITYPSYCHUK


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