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medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture See Lawrence L. Besserman, _The Legend of Job in the Middle Ages_ (Harvard UP, 1979). -- Walter Stephens Charles S. Singleton Professor of Italian Studies Director of Italian Department of German and Romance Languages Johns Hopkins University 408 Gilman Hall / 3400 North Charles Street Baltimore, MD 21218 tel. 001 410 516 7229 fax 516 5358 SPRING 2011 OFFICE HOURS Tu/Th 1:30-3:00 PM On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 9:39 PM, Frans van Liere <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture > > I think Job was, apart from Gregory's Moralia, not all that much commented > on > ... > > Frans van Liere > History Department, Calvin College > 1845 Knollcrest Circle SE > Grand Rapids MI 49546 > >>> Dr Jim Bugslag 03/18/11 8:34 PM >>> > medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture > > Dear Frans, > This is fascinating. Thanks for your translation. Do you know of a > recent analysis of the exegesis of Job? > Cheers, > Jim > > On 17/03/2011 12:23 PM, Frans van Liere wrote: > > medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture > > > > Meg, You you rpobably thinking of more practical example, such as the > fourfold > > sense of the story of Job, exemplified in Hugh's De scripturis et > scriptoribus > > sacris, ch. 3: (mytranslation, from PL 176) > > > > We give here one example of this threefold understanding. There was a man > in > > the land of Us, named Job, who first was rich, but came to such misery > that, > > sitting in the dung heap, he scratched even his healthy body with a > potsherd. > > > The historical sense is clear. Now we come to the allegory, in which we > > consider by the things that are signified by these words other things to > be > > signified, and by one fact another fact. Job, whose name means > “mourning”, > > signifies Christ, who first was coequal to the Father in the richess of > his > > glory, but descended to our misery, and sat humbled on the dung heap of > this > > world, sharing in all our defects for the sake of sin. Now we will ask > what > by > > this fact is signified that must happen, or is worthy to be done. Job can > stand > > for whatever just or penitent soul, who in his memory makes up a dung > heap > out > > of all the sins he has committed and, not for a short time but > perseveringly, > > > sits on it and does not cease to weep while meditating on it. Those > things > that > > happened according to the letter that signifiy such spiritual things are > called > > “sacraments”. > > > > > > > > Frans van Liere > > History Department, Calvin College > > 1845 Knollcrest Circle SE > > Grand Rapids MI 49546 > > > >>>> James Ginther 3/16/2011 8:29 PM>>> > > medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture > > > > Prof Brown makes an important point here: while the fourfold sense was > > acknowledged throughout the Middle Ages, it was not employed uniformly. > The > > early medieval approach differed considerably from the scholastic > approach. > > I have worked more with the latter, and even then amongst the theologians > > of the schools there are significant differences. The distich translated > > here is often credited as coming from the pen of Augustine of Dacia (ca. > > 1260), but Robert Grosseteste has his own formulation specifically for > the > > exegesis of the Psalms (and informed by the Tyconian Rules). The drawback > > of the Cassian example is that it is just an example and not > representative > > of how the various senses were deployed in actual exegesis. For example, > > while the tropological sense (sensus moralis) was certainly tied to what > you > > do (quid agas), theologians like Hugh of St-Cher spoke of it as "in > persona > > animae fidelis" and that often permitted him to discuss what we would > call > > aspects of philosophical psychology. Others, such as Grosseteste and > > Bonaventure, spoke of allegory not as just what you believe, but > > specifically about Christology and/or Ecclesiology. > > > > There is also the other issue of what exactly were the four senses. There > > general agreement but some significant outliers (Augustine muddied the > > waters by talking about an etiological sense--much to the chagrin of the > > scholastic synthesizers), and Hugh of St-Victor only spoke of three > senses. > > > > > > So I would just suggest that the examples given may not completely > present > > the state of play for exegesis in a given time. > > > > If you are interested in later medieval exegesis, Christopher Ocker's > book > > on Biblical Poetics does a very nice job in delineating the complexity of > > that period. And at the risk> entry on exegesis in my Westminster > Handbook to Medieval Theology (partially > > viewable on Google Books). > > > > Jim > > > > > > On Wed, Mar 16, 2011 at 7:08 PM, George Brown wrote: > > > >> medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and > culture > >> > >> Besides Cassian, Gregory the Great in the *Moralia in Job* and Bede in > > *Deschematibus > >> et tropis describe the fourfold formula. In my A Companion to Bede, p. > 25, > >> I have more on the theory of symbol applied to Christian salvific > history > >> where I also cite the medieval distich that served as a memory aid:* > >> *Litera gesta docet, quid credas allegoria,* > >> *Moralis quid agas, quo tendas anagogia.* > >> *[The letter teaches event, allegory what you should believe./ Morality > >> teaches what you should do, anagogy what mark you should be aiming at. * > >> *And I refer to Henri de Lubac's Exégèse médiévale: le quatre sens de > >> l'Écriture (one volume of which has been translated into English). * > >> GHB > >> > >> On Mar 16, 2011, at 4:13 PM, Paul Chandler wrote: > >> > >> medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and > culture > >> You're probably thinking of the famous passage in John Cassian's > >> Conferences, 14.8.4: > >> > >> The four figures that have been mentioned converge in such a way that, > if > >>> we want, one and the same Jerusalem can be understood in a fourfold > > manner. > >>> According to history it is the city of the Jews. According to allegory > it > > is > >>> the Church of Christ. According to anagogy it is that heavenly city of > God > >>> 'which is the mother of us all.' According to tropology it is the soul > of > >>> the human being, which under this name is frequently either reproached > or > >>> praised by the Lord. > >>> > >> (trans. Boniface Ramsey, ACW 57: 510) > >> An older translation is here:< > >> http://www.ccel.org/ccel/cassian/conferences.iii.v.viii.html> -- Paul > >> > >> > >> > >> On 17 March 2011 06:03, Cormack, Margaret Jean wrote: > >> > >>> medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and > culture > >>> > >>> Hi, > >>> Can anyone give me a good example illustrating the four levels of > >>> biblical interpretation? I had a website link which, foolishly, > >>> I never copied onto a 'real' file - and so lost! I have an example > using > >>> 'light' from Thomas Aquinas, but recall seeing one > >>> with Jerusalem - and am wondering if there is an example with the > >>> sacrifice of Isaac as well? > >>> Thanks in advance, > >>> Meg > >>> > >> > >> -- > >> Paul Chandler, O.Carm. > >> Holy Spirit Seminary | PO Box 18 (487 Earnshaw Road) | Banyo Qld 4014 > >> | Australia > >> office: (07) 3246 9888 | home: (07) 3246 9894 > >> [log in to unmask] > >> ********************************************************************** > To > >> join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: > >> [log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: > >> [log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: > >> leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report > >> problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: > >> [log in to unmask] For further information, visit > >> our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html > >> > >> > >> Prof. Em. George Hardin Brown, FMAA, FSA > >> Department of English, 450 Serra Mall > >> Stanford University, Stanford, CA 94305-2087 > >> Home: 451 Adobe Place, Palo Alto, CA 94306-4501 > >> Phones: Mobile: 650-269-9898; Fax: 650-725-0755; Home: 650-852-1231 > >> > >> ********************************************************************** > To > >> join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: > >> [log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: > >> [log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: > >> leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report > >> problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: > >> medieval-religion-r>> our web site: > http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html > >> > > > > > > ********************************************************************** > To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME > to: [log in to unmask] > To send a message to the list, address it to: > [log in to unmask] > To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion > to: [log in to unmask] > In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: > [log in to unmask] > For further information, visit our web site: > http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html > > ********************************************************************** > To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME > to: [log in to unmask] > To send a message to the list, address it to: > [log in to unmask] > To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion > to: [log in to unmask] > In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: > [log in to unmask] > For further information, visit our web site: > http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html > ********************************************************************** To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: [log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: [log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: [log in to unmask] For further information, visit our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html