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Morning All I've been out of the loop for a few days but feel rather responsible for starting this discussion. I would just like to say thanks to everyone who has sent me lists and their thoughts. We're going to try and meld them together and come up with something that works for us for now as obviously our deadlines are rather tight. Phil - when the final version of your list is ready, can you let us all know as I think we would all be interested to see it / comment? Thanks again and you can come out of hiding now. Rachel Rachel Broomfield Historic Environment Officer Plymouth City Council Planning & Regeneration Floor 8 Civic Centre Plymouth PL1 2EW Tel: (01752) 307849 / Fax: (01752) 304231 Email: [log in to unmask] Web: www.plymouth.gov.uk IMPORTANT: This email (including any attachments) should only be used if you are the intended recipient. Email should not be used to convey personal, sensitive or privileged information over the public network. Errors may be present and you should carry out your own virus check. This message may be supplied to an applicant under UK legislation. If the message is marked private it does not represent the views of Plymouth City Council. ________________________________ From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of CARLISLE, Philip Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 9:45 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Dates / period lists Hi Sarah, The list I circulated is the latest evolution of the RCHME Periods wordlist as seen on the INSCRIPTION website. It includes a more detailed breakdown of the POST MEDIEVAL and the replacement of MODERN with 20th CENTURY and 21st CENTURY which are now used in the AMIE database. Unlike HBSMR it still contains overlaps in dates (which we will be removing soon-ish) and it doesn't include pre-20th Century, centuries. I circulated it as an example and not as the final word on the whole date period thing. As I mentioned we are currently revisiting timelines and periods and will circulate whatever we come up with for comments. As members of this list know this particular can of worms was originally opened in 2000 when the e-conference on date/periods/timelines was held on the FISH list. We couldn't reach agreement then and I don't think much has changed since. "Plus ça change, plus c'est la meme chose" as our French cousins might say. I think Simon is right in saying that the only certain way to get around the problem of what you call the period for cross-searching purposes is by searching on dates. But until everyone thinks that way the labels we attach to the dates will always be needed if somewhat contentious I'm going back into hiding now. Phil Phil Carlisle Data Standards Supervisor English Heritage National Monuments Record Centre Kemble Drive Swindon SN2 2GZ +44 (0)1793 414824 http://thesaurus.english-heritage.org.uk/ The information contained within this e-mail is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee only. If you have received the e-mail in error, please inform the sender and delete it from your system. The contents of this e-mail must not be disclosed to anyone else or copied without the sender's consent. Any views and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of English Heritage. English Heritage will not take any responsibility for the views of the author. P Please do not print this e-mail unless you really need to -----Original Message----- From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Poppy Sarah Sent: 05 August 2008 09:16 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Dates / period lists Hi Phil Without further opening the can of worms, the list you circulated yesterday also differs from that on Inscription in both detail and some of the dates, which was always used as the standard for HBSMR installations. What's the status of this new list? thanks Sarah -----Original Message----- From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Gregory Chuter Sent: 05 August 2008 09:05 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Dates / period lists Hi Phil The RCHME time line does not match the HBSMR time line we currently use. Will there be an amendment to this at some stage in line with the EH review of periods / timelines?. Probably opening a whole can of worms here, but the RCHME time line also differs from the one defined by our currently running South East Research Framework. These differences between data sets / projects will surely cause problems for research and data collection in the future. Greg Chuter, Assistant County Archaeologist East Sussex County Council, Transport and Environment, County Hall, St Anne's Crescent, Lewes, East Sussex BN7 1UE Tel: 01273 336177, Fax: 01273 479536, Mob: 07500123634 E-mail: [log in to unmask] -----Original Message----- From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of CARLISLE, Philip Sent: 04 August 2008 17:38 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Dates / period lists Hi Rachel, I'm attaching a copy of the RCHME/EH/MIDAS/INSCRIPTION (depending on who you talk to depends on what it's called!) in CSV format. We (EH) are currently revisiting the whole periods/timelines thing and will be soon updating the dates attached to the periods to remove overlaps and reflect current thinking, particularly with regards to the earlier periods. The file includes our unique ids/parent_uids and the Chronological order field to allow you to build a mini-hierarchy but you can ignore these. I know we're not supposed to attach files but Bruce told me to do it so any complaints please hassle him! Phil Phil Carlisle Data Standards Supervisor English Heritage National Monuments Record Centre Kemble Drive Swindon SN2 2GZ +44 (0)1793 414824 http://thesaurus.english-heritage.org.uk/ The information contained within this e-mail is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee only. If you have received the e-mail in error, please inform the sender and delete it from your system. The contents of this e-mail must not be disclosed to anyone else or copied without the sender's consent. Any views and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of English Heritage. English Heritage will not take any responsibility for the views of the author. P Please do not print this e-mail unless you really need to -----Original Message----- From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Broomfield, Rachel (DEVELOPMENT) Sent: 04 August 2008 17:09 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: Dates / period lists I'm hoping someone out there can help me. We are refining our HER to get it ready to go on the web next year and we are trying to assign dates to the various periods to make it easier for the public to search. However, what we have currently seems to vary greatly from other lists I've seen. Can anyone tell me if there is a definitive list out there somewhere and if so where. Alternatively, would people be prepared to share their lists with us so we can try and create a more comprehensive one? Many thanks Rachel Rachel Broomfield Historic Environment Officer Plymouth City Council Planning & Regeneration Floor 8 Civic Centre Plymouth PL1 2EW Tel: (01752) 307849 / Fax: (01752) 304231 Email: [log in to unmask] Web: www.plymouth.gov.uk <file:///\\www.plymouth.gov.uk> IMPORTANT: This email (including any attachments) should only be used if you are the intended recipient. Email should not be used to convey personal, sensitive or privileged information over the public network. Errors may be present and you should carry out your own virus check. This message may be supplied to an applicant under UK legislation. If the message is marked private it does not represent the views of Plymouth City Council. ________________________________ Concerned about how climate change may affect older properties? What about saving energy? Visit our new website www.climatechangeandyourhome.org.uk <http://www.climatechangeandyourhome.org.uk/> today. This e-mail (and any attachments) is confidential and may contain personal views which are not the views of English Heritage unless specifically stated. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system and notify the sender immediately. Do not use, copy or disclose the information in any way nor act in reliance on it. Any information sent to English Heritage may become publicly available. This message is intended for the use of the addressee only and may contain confidential or privileged information. If you have received it in error please notify the sender and destroy it. You may not use it or copy it to anyone else. E-mail is not a secure communications medium. Please be aware of this when replying. 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Visit our new website www.climatechangeandyourhome.org.uk <http://www.climatechangeandyourhome.org.uk/> today. This e-mail (and any attachments) is confidential and may contain personal views which are not the views of English Heritage unless specifically stated. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system and notify the sender immediately. Do not use, copy or disclose the information in any way nor act in reliance on it. Any information sent to English Heritage may become publicly available.