medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture

From: Ms B M Cook <[log in to unmask]>

> I am not sure who wrote the following, but ....... (see below)

> >>>> You might consult:

> >>>> A Translation of the "Chronicle" of the Abbey of Morigny, France, c. 
1100-1150/. Edited and translated by Richard Cusimano. [Mediaeval 
Studies, Vol. 22.] (Lewiston, New York: Edwin Mellen Press. 2003. Pp. 
ix, 233.)

> >>> quite unreliable in its notes and, i think you may find, in the
precision of its translation, as well.

> >>> a terribly overpriced, ugly little book, cheaply produced by a kind of
> >>> academical Vanity Press.

the initial citation was made by Tom, i believe, but twas i who supplied the

> I have just acquired a copy on ILL (to whom be praise as well as my cheque)

and for someone as challenged in Latinity as I am, it is an undiluted 

yes, Any Port in a Storm, is my motto.

upon looking at the thing again for the first time in several years, i see
that i was mistaken (in another post) in saying that it does not supply the
Latin text --it does, on facing pages, reproducing the Leon Mirot edition of

my apologies for that error.


>It is also very interesting, gives me a new slant on matters I already wot of
and answers my original question (The Council was at Etampes 

yes, you will see no reference, anywhere, to a "Council of Morigny."

among other things, as the chronicle itself says (perhaps without false
modesty), the new monastery was notable for its _paupertas_ (p. 100). 

but, is there *any* instance of a council (significant or otherwise) being
hosted at a monastery?

>but the Pope paid a surprise visit to Morigny which is just up the road and 
the abbot who was off site only just got back in time to welcome His 
Holiness - the kind of social near-disaster which warms my heart - (they had 
'em then, too!!!) So many, many thanks for the reference.

> However, if the above critic could give me a few hits as to just where the 
trans & the notes fall short of perfection (ie are the errors major, central 
and critical, or just a matter of an unfashionable point of view and too 
small a dictionary) I'd be no end grateful....

it's just been too long for me to recall the ocassion i had to check the
translation of a passage and found it wanting.

i'd just say: Use with Care.

what set me off in the notes was no doubt

"Geoffrey of Leves was archbishop of Chartres from 1116-1149." (p. 205, n. 5)

an elevation which only a Pope could make, i believe.

also, his insistence upon referring to Peter Leoni ("Petrus Petri filius,
filii Leonis", p. 96) as "Peter Leo" is a little obnoxious.

Constance Bouchard seems to have liked it well enough, more or less

"Cusimano’s translation is serviceable and faithful to the Latin, although
English is sometimes rather awkward. Latin is in fact very hard to put into
good English without lapsing into paraphrase,but when the chronicle begins
with the ringing,“Noveritis, o posteri nostri.” one wishes for a more
poetic translation than,“Understand, O our future generations [at the
abbey]” (pp. 16-17). Similarly, in a scene where the abbot complains to the
king about his treatment at the hands of the canons of Etampes,“He revealed
the affront” is indeed an accurate translation of “Pandit injuriam” (pp.
38-39), but it is not graceful English.

"This said, the volume should be warmly welcomed. It makes an important
and fascinating chronicle much more accessible. It is however unfortunate
it was brought out by the Edwin Mellen Press, which means that it is priced
out of the range of most individuals and will not be bought by most
given the rather unsavory reputation of some other Mellen books. Perhaps an
academic press will take up the paperback rights; it would be an excellent
book to use in an upper-level class on medieval monasticism.

but then she also says that there are "handsome color photographs of the
churches mentioned," which suggests to me that she is as Aesthetically
Challenged as i am Latiniacally so.

those digital, low-rez, over-exposed, off-color monsters range from the merely
ugly to the laughable.

and Connie certainly didn't try to read the endnotes along with the text --i
have never seen a book so poorly laid out in this way.  the numbering of the
notes starts anew with each chapter of the chronicle, with no indication on
the pages which chapter one might happen to be in.

quite an astonishingly screwed up system.

> And this, dear Gordon, brings the discussion firmly back to med rel for what
is more med rel than a monastic chronicle of the 12th C ??   (:-))


anybody who bothers to complain about what other people write to this list
deserves whatever he gets.


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