medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture >members of the same family are frequently commemorated on the same day in necrologies - they can't >ALL have died together ! Note also the numbers of saints of the same name commemorated on the same or subsequent days. Graham **************************************** Dr Graham Jones Lecturer in English Topography University of Leicester Centre for English Local History Marc Fitch Historical Institute 5 Salisbury Road Leicester LE1 7QR United Kingdom Tel: +44 (0)116 252 2764 Fax: +44 (0)116 252 5769 e-Mail: [log in to unmask] Web pages: http://www.le.ac.uk/elh/grj1 -----Original Message----- From: Ms Brenda M. Cook [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Sent: 04 July 2002 21:47 To: [log in to unmask] Subject: [M-R] Visitation &c medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture Theoretically, once the > (purely fictional) date of Christmas was set, all > other dates (as was the case with the Annunciation) > should have followed from that date. I absolutely agree with the rest, but I quibble with the phrase "purely fictional" for Dec 25th as the commemoration of the birth of Christ. Surely we should see this as his official birthday, the convenient and symbolically appropriate day for his birth to be celebrated ? After all, the Queen has her Official Birthday on June 8th (this year - it can vary a bit from year to year), a suitable day for outdoor ceremonial and approximately six months from the New Year, that other occasion on which Honours are announced. The (then) Princess Elizabeth of York was actually born on 21 April 1926. I suspect that to the mediaeval mind it was more important to celebrate an event regularly every year than to be bureaucratically accurate as to date - something which was not always known. I am specifically thinking of the discrepancies in the death dates recorded for the same person in different necrologies and chronicles - and the fact that I suspect that the day in a necrology when the death is commemorated is the anniversary of the day the NEWS of the death of the first recorded, or most socially significant member of the family, reached the ecclesiastical institution, and was the anniversary of the first requiem mass rather than of the actual death. (The rest of the family got added later.) After all, even if you KNEW the date X had died, you were not going to wait ten or more months to pray for his soul on the "right" day. Brenda MC ********************************************************************** To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: [log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: [log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: [log in to unmask] For further information, visit our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html ********************************************************************** To join the list, send the message: join medieval-religion YOUR NAME to: [log in to unmask] To send a message to the list, address it to: [log in to unmask] To leave the list, send the message: leave medieval-religion to: [log in to unmask] In order to report problems or to contact the list's owners, write to: [log in to unmask] For further information, visit our web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/medieval-religion.html