JiscMail Logo
Email discussion lists for the UK Education and Research communities

Help for PHYSIO Archives


PHYSIO Archives

PHYSIO Archives


PHYSIO@JISCMAIL.AC.UK


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

PHYSIO Home

PHYSIO Home

PHYSIO  November 1999

PHYSIO November 1999

Options

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password

Subject:

LIFTING RHYTHM?

From:

[log in to unmask]

Reply-To:

[log in to unmask]

Date:

Sun, 21 Nov 1999 03:16:36 EST

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (92 lines)

These extracts from a discussion which I had with a student who contacted me 
recently may be of interest to this group.

<< Dear Dr Siff,   After reading that collection of references you sent on 
LIFTING REVISITED, I thought that you might be interested in the latest Chek 
Institute videos, especially this one:

> Understanding Force Couple Relationships

-Understand the spino-scapular/gleno-humeral force couple mechanism
-Learn how to identify force couples in the sagittal, frontal and transverse 
planes
-Understand lumbo-pelvic rhythm >

It seems that the Chek guys still didn't get it when you and some others 
pointed out that their concept of a force couple is incorrect and 
unscientific.  They also seem to preach that old PT lumbo-pelvic rythm that I 
think was popularized by Calliet, even though I think you said  this rhythm 
also involves the knee joint because it is crossed by muscles that cross the 
hips and knee joints.>

***Thank you, that was most interesting - after all that discussion that we 
had some months ago on forces and couples, I am surprised that this 
deficiency in their teaching material was not revised.  

Yes, it was probably R Cailliet ('Low Back Pain Syndrome'  pp44-49) who 
popularised the lumbar-pelvic lifting rhythm.  Although he used the term 
"lumbar-pelvic rhythm", his discussion certainly involved the action of the 
knee flexors and extensors.   He wrote:

"One of the mechanical advantages of flexing the hips and knees is that it 
places the hip extensors at a mechanical advantage.  Another advantage is 
that the quadriceps femoris group assists in the lifting and simultaneously 
tenses the iliotibial band which is the site of attachment of the glutei."

In other words, Cailliet did recognise the role of the knee linkage system in 
lifting, but he chose to retain the term "lumbar-pelvic rhythm", possibly 
because he was more interested in only the trunk aspect of lifting.  Of 
course, since the gastrocs and soleus both cross the knee joint, they also 
play an important role in the overall lifting sequence, a fact that is 
stressed in several biomechanics articles on functional sporting movement.  

If one uses the "double knee-bend" technique, or more correctly tries to 
accentuate its use, then the role of soleus and gastrocs become even more 
important, though Cailliet showed no clear awareness of the various methods 
of lifting used by the different types of competitive lifter.

If we bear carefully in mind that Cailliet was focusing on only one aspect of 
the lifting chain of events, we may be justified in talking about the 
"lumbar-pelvic rhythm" as one of several other related rhythms involved in 
the process of lifting.  However, it is incorrect and misleading to regard 
the "lumbar-pelvic rhythm" as the only or most important aspect of efficient 
and safe lifting.  

As some of those studies showed, there is no compelling evidence that stoop 
lifting is associated with a higher incidence of spinal pain and dysfunction 
than squat lifting.  In fact, it is not uncommon to observe some extremely 
strong Powerlifters using a more stooped style of deadlifting for years 
without spinal damage.

The papers that I summarised in my post on "Lifting Revisited" strongly 
suggested that there is no single correct or safe rhythm, but a number of 
different rhythms which take place during squat type lifting and stoop 
lifting, as well as between Olympic-type lifting that intentionally 
exaggerates the "double knee bend" technique, and Powerlifting-type lifting 
that forbids one to rebend the knees at any stage of the deadlift.  Clearly, 
the Chek group was unaware of these findings at their time of production.  

Russian studies have shown (published in the 'Lehrbeilage Gewichtheben' 
weightlfiting manuals from Germany) too, that lifting posture is strongly 
determined by the relative ratios of lengths of leg and thigh, arm length and 
torso length and other such kinanthropometric measures.

Once again it is apparent that many popularised solutions to the back pain 
and disability issue still tend to be simplistic and limited, but I have no 
doubt that most omissions eventually will be rectified when scientists and 
clinicians begin to appreciate more widely that all forms of competitive 
lifting (including "Strong Man' contests and Highland Games) offer a natural 
laboratory with a wealth of practical information for the general public.

Mel Siff

Dr Mel C Siff
Denver, USA
[log in to unmask]





%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

JiscMail Tools


RSS Feeds and Sharing


Advanced Options


Archives

March 2024
February 2024
December 2023
October 2023
August 2023
July 2023
June 2023
May 2023
April 2023
December 2022
October 2022
September 2022
May 2022
December 2021
November 2021
August 2021
June 2021
May 2021
April 2021
March 2021
February 2021
September 2020
July 2020
April 2020
February 2020
January 2020
December 2019
November 2019
October 2019
September 2019
May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003
December 2002
November 2002
October 2002
September 2002
August 2002
July 2002
June 2002
May 2002
April 2002
March 2002
February 2002
January 2002
December 2001
November 2001
October 2001
September 2001
August 2001
July 2001
June 2001
May 2001
April 2001
March 2001
February 2001
January 2001
December 2000
November 2000
October 2000
September 2000
August 2000
July 2000
June 2000
May 2000
April 2000
March 2000
February 2000
January 2000
December 1999
November 1999
October 1999
September 1999
August 1999
July 1999
June 1999
May 1999
April 1999
March 1999
February 1999
January 1999
December 1998
November 1998
October 1998
September 1998
August 1998
July 1998
June 1998
May 1998
April 1998
March 1998


JiscMail is a Jisc service.

View our service policies at https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/ and Jisc's privacy policy at https://www.jisc.ac.uk/website/privacy-notice

For help and support help@jisc.ac.uk

Secured by F-Secure Anti-Virus CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager