JiscMail Logo
Email discussion lists for the UK Education and Research communities

Help for BRITISH-IRISH-POETS Archives


BRITISH-IRISH-POETS Archives

BRITISH-IRISH-POETS Archives


BRITISH-IRISH-POETS@JISCMAIL.AC.UK


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

BRITISH-IRISH-POETS Home

BRITISH-IRISH-POETS Home

BRITISH-IRISH-POETS  1998

BRITISH-IRISH-POETS 1998

Options

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password

Subject:

Re: hypertext (long)

From:

krumm <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

krumm <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:39:39 +0100

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (80 lines)


George,

>> One senses the possibility of a whole new type of poem. The poem as
>> infinitude of choices; the poem liberated of the tyranny of sequence;
>> the poem as a matrix of possibilities.

Over on news:alt.hypertext there is much discussion of the sort of questions
you raise and most people seem to be of the opinion that there are very few,
if any, examples of "successful" hypertext poetry or prose. The ones which
seem to be considered to be state of the art are only available by download or
by post after payment has been made - the pig in a poke option. Most of the
"hypertexts" which I would describe as compelling reading are in fact linear.
The maze-like texts all seem to have the "That was quite nice" quality. I
feel that the hypertext poem, like many other aspects of computer mediated
communication, needs some sort user interface in order to supply the
structure which the reader needs in order to avoid the feeling of "wandering
aimlessly" in something which could be formless and/or endless.

[log in to unmask] (Mark Bernstein) writes:
>> It's not a hypertext because it has links.
>> It's a hypertext because those links create structure for the reader

I agree that the hypertext poet needs new ways of thinking about hir work.
The hypertext poet should enable the reader as explorer which would seem to
suggest that there must be some means of navigating to particular places
within the text with purpose rather than by sheer chance. It has been
suggested on alt.hypertext that the means by which we experience hypertext,
the web browser, is actually very limited as interface to multiple page
documents. Ideally we would open each page in a new window and be able to
move easily from window to window, possibly by using some sort of visual
device such as the "tree", and so avoid the linear progress which is not only
contrary to the concept of hypertext but distracting in terms of lack of
structure from the reader's point of view. By such means we would eventually
have the whole work available and be able to begin to perceive or even create
a structure. Also, it strikes me as unreasonable to expect the reader to
enter a text and begin reading not knowing whether it is going to be smaller
than a slim volume or larger than a collected works.

>> One senses the possibility of a whole new relationship with the reader -
>> the reader as  explorer; the reader as game-player; the reader as 
>> co-author

The question of involving the reader as co-author (or even solver of puzzles)
is even more difficult but could possibly be achieved with the use of
scripts, frames, and other devices. My own sporadic efforts to produce an
interactive poem have involved the use of Javascript buttons (_Schwitters
Box_), drop down selection boxes (_Toy_, a multiple choice poem), and frames
(a work in progress of which I have high hopes). I have not yet been able to
finish a true hypertext which satisfies my own requirements in terms of ease
of use and clarity of structure.

>> We have used narrative devices to swing the reader from page to page.

Your narrative devices work very well. I notice that a certain amount of
looping back is possible at the end of the poem with a number of possible
endings being available and would suggest that if that could be extended to
take one further towards various beginnings it would enhance the interface
somewhat. In fact the end could be a good place to start. The option to
"begin again" (which follows the final stanza) is risky as the reader has the
sense of having emerged and may just wander off ...

BTW, your link "back to Snakeskin" seems to be broken.


Regards,


Steve


---------------------------------
[log in to unmask]

http://www.btinternet.com/~debris
---------------------------------


%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

JiscMail Tools


RSS Feeds and Sharing


Advanced Options


Archives

September 2019
August 2019
July 2019
June 2019
May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
2006
2005
2004
2003
2002
2001
2000
1999
1998
1997


JiscMail is a Jisc service.

View our service policies at https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/ and Jisc's privacy policy at https://www.jisc.ac.uk/website/privacy-notice

Secured by F-Secure Anti-Virus CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager