But you still need to maintain the same entity ID value *as well as* the
same ePTID hash values.
James, I too would be interested know why you can't keep the same entity
ID as before? As Andy said, there is no requirement for it to have any
particular relationship with the hostname in the endpoint URLs (the
On 10/09/2015 10:17, Andrew Wiles [aew] wrote:
> This is what we're currently doing at Aber.
> We set up our 1.3 IdP with a binary salt kept in the keystore, which it is not possible to use in the out of the box 2.4 IdP (the XML parsers choked when we tried), so we've got a local patch which lets us base64 encode / decode our salt from the XML file.
> Obviously this is unmaintainable (although already ported to IdP 3), and we've been collecting and storing the ComputedIDs in a SQLite database for when we decide we've collected enough of them we can stop using our local patch.
> Andrew Wiles .
> TÓm Cymwysiadau ac Integreiddio / Applications and Integration Team .
> Datblygu Cymwysiadau / Application Development .
> Gwasanaethau Gwybodaeth / Information Services .
> Prifysgol Aberystwyth University .
> E-bost/Email [log in to unmask] .
> Gwe/Web http://neidio.aber.ac.uk/?lv / http://jump.aber.ac.uk/?nv
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Discussion list for Shibboleth developments [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Haynes, Jonathan
> Sent: 10 September 2015 10:10
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Migrating to a new IdP
> I think you might be able to get around this problem with the StoredID connector. This stores the persistent identifiers in a database which you could manipulate.
> This is completely untested so I could be wrong!
> 1. On your current IDP set up StoredID instead of ComputedID
> 2. By default it creates identifiers in the same way as ComputedId so your users will get the same values (assuming you use the same salt) but these will be stored for future use.
> 3. Take the database from the old IDP, change all the values in the local entity column to your new entity ID and install on the new IDP.
> 4. Your existing users will get the same persistent ids read from the database. New users and existing users going to a new (to them) SP will get a newly created persistent id using the standard algorithm and the new entityID.
> It may be that you consider the solution worse than the problem. You have to maintain a database as well as your shib IDP so there are more moving parts. And you will have to maintain this database going forward - it isn't just something to be used during the transition (Only if all your existing users finish, or you drop access to all SPs with personalisation that you currently use can you return to using ComputedID). If you have HA or a server farm for your IDPs then all need to see the same database and you need database replication etc.
> And if you are needing to run both IDPs in parallel they both need to read/write the same database.
> Like others I would say try to avoid changing your entity id but this is just a suggestion for personalisation issues if you really have to.
> Jonathan Haynes
> Senior Network Specialist
> IT Department Tel: 01234 754205
> Bld 63, e-mail: [log in to unmask]
> Cranfield University,
> Beds, MK43 0AL
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Discussion list for Shibboleth developments [mailto:JISC-
>> [log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Sara Hopkins
>> Sent: 09 September 2015 19:45
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: Migrating to a new IdP
>> Hi James,
>> Further to what my colleague Steve said here; yes, if your entity ID
>> changes then your eduPersonTargetedID / persistent-id values will
>> change and all (not almost all, but all!) your Digimap users will need
>> to re-register and will lose access to work they have saved in their old
>> profiles. The same is true for other SPs with personalisation features.
>> So I would strongly recommend that (if it is possible to do so) you set
>> up the software so that the hash value component of the ePTID/persistent
>> ID remains the same for all your (user, SP) pairs, and that the entity
>> ID of the new IdP when it goes into production is the same as the
>> current production entity ID.
>> Sara Hopkins
>> UK federation support team
>> On 09/09/2015 17:49, Steve Glover wrote:
>>> Hi James,
>>> We don't have specific guidance for this case, but the page we have for
>>> IdP operators moving from hosted to local solutions may give you some
>>> idea of the potential bumps and potholes in the road ahead:
>>> As to how the various SPs handle a change on the IdP side, "it depends":
>>> some will need to be told specifically, some may be able to permit use
>>> of old and new IdPs during the changeover if you ask them, some won't
>>> seem to mind (or perhaps care) and some will take longer than others to
>>> pick up that a change has happened at all.
>>> One good bit of news: you won't need to tell DigiMap you've changed
>>> entityID: it cares more about the scope. However, changing your entityID
>>> will mean that your eduPersonTargetedID / persistent-id values will
>>> change and almost all your DigiMap users will need to re-register.
>>> losing any saved resources in the meantime - so you may need to keep the
>>> old IdP running in parallel with the new one for some time.
>>> Hoping this is useful,
>>> On 09/09/15 16:59, Todd, James wrote:
>>>> Hi All
>>>> We're currently setting up a PingFederate IdP cluster to replace our
>>>> ADFS\Shib 2.3\Novell Access Manager mish-mash of an SSO solution and
>>>> my attention has turned to the UK Federation portion of things.
>>>> One of the challenges I forsee is getting the new EntityID out to all
>>>> the SPs our students and staff may use. There are a couple of SPs in
>>>> the federation which are there specifically for us and I'll contact
>>>> them of course, but for the rest (your DigiMaps, JSTOR etc) that's
>>>> going to be a lot of SPs for me to contact.
>>>> Anybody who has gone through an IdP migration recently: what approach
>>>> have you taken to a smooth transition? Are there a known list of SPs
>>>> perhaps who really check the EntityID of the IdP, and are there some
>>>> who are satisfied with the IdP just being in the federation metadata?
>>>> This may seem like a silly question, but I'm just looking for a way to
>>>> avoid a long drawn out manual process for hundreds of SPs...
>>>> James Todd | Data Centre & Operations Analyst
>>>> Edinburgh Napier University
>>>> Craiglockhart Campus
>>>> EH14 1DJ
>>>> Tel: 0131 455 4313
>>>> Email: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
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>> Sara Hopkins
>> Support Team
>> UK Access Management Federation for Education and Research
>> web: http://www.ukfederation.org.uk/
>> The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in
>> Scotland, with registration number SC005336.
UK Access Management Federation for Education and Research
The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in
Scotland, with registration number SC005336.