Nicely put John, as a resident of Epsom and a regular racing and leisure cyclist around Surrey hills etc, I think that just about sums up police attitude.
It is noticeable that they have been 'patrolling' races this year just in case a racer momentarily crosses that white line in the road and they can pop out and have a word!
I think there is a definite parallel here with how mountainbiking was viewed by ramblers/countryside users back in the early 90's, and with the visible increase in cycling some road users and residents ( not to mention officialdom) don't especially like a changing world.
On the Tester - Roadies issue. Hmm, i think amongst 'new' ie clubs formed or flourishing this century it is largely a minor-issue. As an example in Surrey the Grand Prix Des Gentlemen 2 up TT a couple of weekends back had scores of 'roadies' taking part amongst 'testers' and the club I belong to had almost twelve pairs of riders out, some in TT gear, some not. There wasn't the remotest hint of animosity within the group, and the same applied to other clubs who had several pairs participating. But it definitely does have historical roots of antagonism, and again similarities with that of mountainbikers and roadies. I think Les Woodland s' book covers this last point, but there are others that detail the relationship between the two in post war era when 'open road' cycle races were banned.
The topic of the emergence of Audax, Randonneur, Sportive, and Grand Fondo events has a complex relationship with the above and again there are some good sources of info on that which i will try to dig out (a few are in french).
Regards
Graham
Graham Berridge
National Teaching Fellow 2010
Programme Leader Events Management
Senior Lecturer
University of West London
uwl.ac.uk
'Education that works'
T: 02085795000
E: [log in to unmask]
________________________________________
From: Cycling and Society Research Group discussion list [[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John Meudell [[log in to unmask]]
Sent: 31 October 2012 10:51
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Cycling club membership
As a resident in the area around Boxhill (I live in Dorking) I'd confirm
that the police here have a bit of a "hard on" regarding cycling the area.
In truth it's had more to do with a couple of young (senior) officers trying
to make a reputation by inventing problems, and issues of over-reaction
aren't just confined to cycling. Thing is that between us, the cycling
organizations have combined to give the police a bit of bloody nose which
seems, for the moment, to have quietened them down. But they are still
"constructively" anti-cycling....refusing to accept reports of dangerous
driving (in one case it happened in front of six of their officers...and
they still wouldn't take a report) whilst at the same time complaining
publically about non-illgeal riding on the part of cyclists.
Leaving that aside, this whole issue of animosity between the sub-groups
within cycling is quite complex, influenced by both internal tensions but
also external pressures and incentives. There was quite a good article
written in Cycling Plus on the subject a lotta years back. I still have a
copy somewhere as I was looking to use it in a research project I had at the
time. I think it was in the late 90's, possibly written by someone called
Thoroughgood (?), but it'll take me few days in the cellar to find it....
Cheers
John Meudell
-----Original Message-----
From: Cycling and Society Research Group discussion list
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Alan Munro
Sent: 31 October 2012 10:23
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Cycling club membership
Yes, to back up Peter, you have the history wrong. The real animosity was
between time triallists and those who wanted to do mass races as in Europe.
The time triallists were terribly diffident about their sport and arranged
the time trials at very early times in the morning (e.g. Sunday morning) so
as not to inconvenience car drivers. They also tended to wear black wool so
as not to bother people with bright fabrics. Actually, I was pretty sure
that book mentioned all this.
I'm vague about this - but I suspect that is why audax and latterly sportif
events came about - it was partly a way to get round the antipathy by the
authorities to racing.
I note that this is still continuing. An interesting example recently was I
think a month before the Olympics one of the races around Box Hill was
stopped by police. The organisers complained that there seemed quite zealous
policing - but there are two sides to every story.
http://road.cc/content/news/62519-police-and-cyclists-loggerheads-over-surre
y-league-race-cancellation
alan munro
On 31 Oct 2012, at 09:52, Peter Cox wrote:
> Hmm
> Not quite
> CTC first organised touring club 1878. During 1930's CTC local groups also
created racing sections, collaborated with NCU and CTT on campaigns (see
Cox, P. (2012) "A Denial of our Boasted Civilisation": cyclists' view on
conflicts over road use in Britain, 1926-1935 Transfers, 2 (3) 4-30).
Hilton's work is a good memoir but not a history - Life's much more
complicated. If you want real animosity then the conflict between the NCU
and the BLRC is the one you want.... they only officially buried the hatchet
and issued formal apologies last year after 70 years. Cycling (the 'racing'
paper) also carried touring articles right through into the 1960s.
>
> Antipathies between clubs do run deeep but these can also be like football
team rivalries within a locale.
>
> Peter Cox
> Senior Lecturer
> Department of Social Studies and Counselling University of Chester
> Parkgate Road, Chester
> CH1 4BJ, United Kingdom
> +44 (0)1244 512039
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Cycling and Society Research Group discussion list
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Speed, Ewen S
> Sent: 31 October 2012 09:32
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Cycling club membership
>
> Hi
>
> This is an interesting discussion and is something I have been thinking
about in terms of the UK case. Tim Hilton in his excellent book "one more
kilometre and we're in the showers" talks about deep seated historical
animosity between tourers (opposed to racing) and Leaguers - racers and time
trialists...I get the sense from Hilton that this legacy runs deep in UK
cycling. As I understand it, the tourers morphed into the CTC (and I get the
sense that the CTC generates much antipathy, rather like marmite, you either
love them or hate them). I am not sure what organisations the leaguers
morphed into, (British Cycling maybe?) but I am sure these antipathies could
still play a part in club memberships, what sorts of clubs attract what sort
of riders etc....
>
> best, Ewen
>
> Ewen Speed, PhD
>
> Senior Lecturer in Medical Sociology
> Graduate Director (Research)
> School of Health & Human Sciences
> University of Essex
> CO4 3SQ
>
> e: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>
> blog: www.cost-ofliving.net<http://www.cost-ofliving.net>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 31 Oct 2012, at 09:05, heston roop
<[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
>
> There are many clubs focused across the entire spectrum of cycling. I
studied and compiled many people's experiences in the US midwest and
southeast. Mostly road racers; but there were many MTN biking clubs,
cyclocross and track racing clubs as well as recreation type clubs. An
excellent example of recreational clubs that are family orientaed look at
RABRI "ride across Iowa" participants as well as rides such as Multiple
Siroccos ride.
> Best,
> Heston Roop
>
> From: burton richard
> <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>>
> To:
> [log in to unmask]<mailto:CYCLING-AND-SOCIETY@JISCMAIL
> .AC.UK>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2012 12:26 PM
> Subject: Re: Cycling club membership
>
> Not sure I'd describe them as meeting the needs of the entire community.
From their website, they seem to be almost totally dedicated to competitive
cycling: no family rides, no beginners rides.
>
> On 30 October 2012 19:47, Richard Lewis
<[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
> Mirela,
>
> If anyone can tell you the answer to this, the organisers of Cycling Club
Hackney can. Have a look at their website to see how they meet the needs of
the entire community.
>
> cyclingclubhackney.co.uk/<http://cyclingclubhackney.co.uk/>
>
> Regards
> Richard.
>
>
> On Tue, 2012-10-30 at 14:28 +0000, Mirela Oliver, Research Assistant
> wrote:
>> Does anyone know of any research into cycling club membership needs and/
or member's requirements when joining a cycling clu?
>>
>> Mirela Oliver, Research Assistant on behalf of Graham Berridge, School of
Hospitality and Tourism, University of West London.
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