medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
Wikipedia (source of all things reliable) says that the vexillum started
as a papal thing during the Investiture Controversy, long after the
ivories were made. Is this right? And of course the item is held on the
Paul side of the ivories, not the Peter side.
Also, it appears to me that the Paul/Andrew figure is likewise holding
something rectangular, just a bit lower down than Peter/Philip. Of
course, between a distinctly non-naturalistic style and a fair bit of
surface wear, it's really anyone's guess.
On 5/5/2012 2:06 PM, Dr Jim Bugslag wrote:
> medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
>
> On the other hand, Peter is associated with a vexillum, which was
> presented by popes to those fighting on their behalf.
> Jim
>
> On 05/05/2012 12:32 PM, Robert Kraft wrote:
>> medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and
>> culture
>>
>> When I checked the images, after CC's post, I was interested to find
>> the figure on the left holding a book (a codex, it seems; or a
>> tablet), since some earlier depictions of Philip on this thread show
>> him holding some sort of roll (not clear whether one read
>> horizontally or vertically; is it because Philip interprets Isaiah to
>> the Ethiopian Eunuch in Acts?). I don't recall Peter being associated
>> with book holding in the artistic conventions, so I wonder if maybe
>> CC is onto something here.
>>
>> Bob Kraft. UPenn emeritus
>>
>> On 5/5/2012 9:54 AM, Genevra Kornbluth wrote:
>>> medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and
>>> culture
>>>
>>> Sorry for the delay in my response to CC-- this is a busy time of year.
>>> The panels are each 29 cm high (11.4"). The figures are generally
>>> identified as Peter and Paul, but really, it could go either way.
>>> They are not distinguished physiognomically. Neither is balding or
>>> bearded, and a beard was as standard for Andrew as it was for Peter.
>>> The object held by Paul/Andrew is normally identified as a labarum
>>> (not standard iconography for any apostle that I know of!).
>>>
>>> On 5/3/2012 2:19 PM, Christopher Crockett wrote:
>>>> http://www.kornbluthphoto.com/images/HarrachDipt2.jpg
>>>> but surely the two figures here are not Pete & Paulie, but Phil and
>>>> Andy? (where's Pete's beard and, what, did he get a hair
>>>> transplant?)...and what is that attribute the figure on the right
>>>> is holding?
>>>
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