An open society means one in which religion itself can be challenged, not merely one in which adherents can criticize one another.
The conflicts among Christians in the Reformation and in religious wars thereafter have little to do with an open society.
Robin Horton, an esteemed English anthropologist who has spent his career in Nigeria, contrasts the openness of Western society to that of African society. (He is also an authority on magic, by the way.)
This list should have a moderator. Other lists do. A moderator would keep out the viciousness evinced in the past day. When real scholars debate, they use arguments and evidence. Their arguments are impersonal. But then they have the goods.
Robert Segal (Prof.)
From: Society for The Academic Study of Magic [[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of N.W. Azal [[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 7:42 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [ACADEMIC-STUDY-MAGIC]
On a separate issue: Western academic standards are infinitely higher than those found in native cultures because they are self-critical--a point that has happily been made already. The West evinces what Popper calls an open society. Only slowly is the rest of the world moving from a closed society to an open one. For us to be informed that it is the West which is close-minded is laughable
It is far more laughable to have to point out that self-critical methodologies were not invented by the modern secular Western Academy and have been around among various non-Western intellectual traditions longer than some would like to admit. As such the assertion above is a blatant form of triumphalism predicated on a lack of information. My own training is in Islam, and the Iranian Shi'ite Islamic milieu specifically. There have been critical methodologies in almost all branches of the traditional Islamic sciences in the Shi'ite world as far back as the 10th/11th centuries CE. It was such critical methodolgies during the Abbasid period that allowed Muslim philosophers to reassemble the Greek philosophical heritage when Europe and the Eastern Roman Christians were busily casting most of it to the flames. Let me suggest you look at Franz Rosenthal's KNOWELDGE TRIUMPHANT to disabuse yourself of a few of the notions you currently hold about the inferiority of the Islamic intellectual tradition and its lack of self-critical methodologies. Unfortunately the bulk of this textual tradition of critical discourse remains in the original language, and those mostly in manuscripts rather than printed editions, so unless one is trained in the language one has no access to the material, so it is understandable why some may think this way. Mutatis mutandis, the same arguments apply to Tibet and Nepal.
On Mon, Apr 23, 2012 at 8:04 PM, Segal, Professor Robert A. <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
April 23
Dear Dave E,
Getting two PhDs does not evince madness. I suggest that what is appropriate is respect rather than, as appears customary on this list, ridicule. There are persons who get two doctorates because they want to master linking fields. For example, philosophers nowadays are almost required to be expert in another field, such as a science. Not all proceed to a second doctorate, but many do immerse themselves in a second field. The greatest case I have ever come upon is that of an American philosopher of science, Kenneth Schaffner, who received a PhD in philosophy and then got an MD--this to be able to understand science in medicine. He wasn't nuts. Maybe you should read his DISCOVERY AND EXPLANATION IN BIOLOGY AND MEDICINE before presuming to judge others.
On a separate issue: Western academic standards are infinitely higher than those found in native cultures because they are self-critical--a point that has happily been made already. The West evinces what Popper calls an open society. Only slowly is the rest of the world moving from a closed society to an open one. For us to be informed that it is the West which is close-minded is laughable.
For example, the study of the Bible has been blessed by the emergence of criticism--a development that goes back to Spinoza. The study of the Koran would benefit from a comparable process, which, for all I know, has begun.
In the scientific culture of the West one is free to make any claim, but one is then required to back it up. One cannot appeal to authority, as often holds elsewhere. And appeals to one's own struggle with a bad marriage or lifetime illness are not germane.
Academic life is not for everyone, but it is for anyone who is serious about studying a subject. The fact that a PhD scarcely guarantees a job is a separate consideration. And academia can pay very well--for those who do well by its standards, which are objective.
Robert
________________________________________
From: Society for The Academic Study of Magic [[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>] On Behalf Of Dr Dave Evans [[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>]
Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 6:42 PM
To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [ACADEMIC-STUDY-MAGIC] two PhDs, was Digest - 23 Apr 2012 - Special issue (#2012-84)
both excellent scholars, both male, both a little bit nuts, IMO. One did enough for my hair colour and mental health...
It would be an interesting project to see which disciplines such 'Doctor Squared' folk (as i call them, 2 PhDs) do their first and second doctorates in, across academia in general. I have a suspicion that many will be n harder sciences, followed by softer interpretative areas, as i think that some peole do a PhD for a job, and later decide to do something in an area of personal interest in order to make a career change. Interestingly, both of the Dr2s that I know are working outside academia now.
Dave E
The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.
The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.
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