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POETRYETC  February 2012

POETRYETC February 2012

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Subject:

Re: Writers Forum Workshop

From:

Lawrence Upton <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Poetryetc: poetry and poetics

Date:

Thu, 9 Feb 2012 11:33:14 -0000

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (198 lines)

I hope it is inviting.

It doesn't please those who want to be TOLD -- the late Eric Mottram had a
poem about those who wake in the middle of the night saying _I need a
judge_

nor those who see themselves primarily as in the vanguard of anything

well they *may well be; but the danger is when that starts to steer their
behaviour

each time one goes back to the blank sheet of paper, graphic medium,
recording medium; and no amount of talking it up will help make the result
better than it is

& there's always someone who hasn't heard what you've heard or who doesn't
share your assumption. I was talking at some length a while back with a
woman for whom music is THE thing; but who has for whatever reason  not
managed to attend to anything much after she was born except maybe
Britten. I might tut about that. I might be incredulous. But she's bright
and otherwise knowledgeable. It did however stop me when she said Who's
Stockhausen?

Those who seem to me more uninformed than I often give me good ideas,
perhaps without knowing it. I value hearing from those who don't much use
overtly innovatory ideas; people whose own innovation arises from poetic
need rather than a need to cut a slot marking success in their desks.

So, yes, minimum coordination to get through anything that needs getting
through and to ensure that everyone gets a fair amount of time -- more one
week than another. A way of getting people to speak with each other

One can't ever *be the founder and I doubt there's any point; any attempt
will turn into what I call, in this case, _the church of Bob_

But I think he was getting it about right; and it's done; and we do what
we can

it is to do with something said here, a while back, I think by you,
_working hopefully but without hope_

Pardon me if I have trashed the words in my partial assimilation of them

I don't think Bob quite thought of his own work that way; but there was a
great humility to him

So... we wait for a reply from Qantas

L


On Thu, February 9, 2012 02:52, Andrew Burke wrote:
> Thanks, Lawrence - I'm clearer now. Not rigid but with a coordinator at
> the rudder. Seems inviting. Andrew
>
> On 8 February 2012 23:33, Douglas Barbour <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>
>> So it's a bit like what goes on here at times...?
>>
>>
>> Doug
>> On 2012-02-08, at 7:45 AM, Lawrence Upton wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Well, hang on, #63 goes as far as Brockley. That's on the way by
>>> several miles.
>>>
>>> Formats vary but stay the same.
>>>
>>>
>>> We gather downstairs in the pub and sometimes hang on there till
>>> after 4 if we know or think we know someone is coming.
>>>
>>> But generally we go upstairs around 4 and sit around, sometimes
>>>
>> inheriting
>>> a furniture configuration, sometimes moving it a bit, sometimes
>>> coping because there's an odd but deliberate layout for a later event.
>>>
>>>
>>> I usually say something ex cathedra, ex convenor, though I may not be
>>> the first to speak; it's rather informal.
>>>
>>> There are not many of us for various reasons; but that's not the main
>>>
>> point.
>>>
>>> I have noticed that I tend to say _who would be first?_ which may be
>>> indicative of pedantry. (Later I say _who would be next?_... I may
>>> stop now I have vocalised it. I always forget until I have done it
>>> again weeks later.)
>>>
>>> Someone reads. Someone else reads. We time out or run out of work.
>>>
>>>
>>> Over the last 18 months or so, talking about the work has increased
>>> greatly. The implicit injunction has always been not to make
>>> destructive criticism (e.g. I don't call that poetry, that's not a
>>> sonnet, being widespread obviuous examples of what we are trying to
>>> avoid.)
>>>
>>> Clearly, from bits and pieces archived that I have read, that was
>>> happening in the early days in the 50s and a bit later. In those days
>>> typed texts sent in advance were the order of business. By the time I
>>>  started going in the early 70s, work was received without comment or
>>>  enthusiasm. This was Cobbing. I am not sure how many would have had
>>> the imagination to steer it in another direction without any aesthetic
>>> /
>>> ideological undertow. If he really couldn't cope, he tended to say
>>> nothing; mostly he said _very good_ but without much emphasis on
>>> either word. I'd like to think that I would be where I am now, but it
>>> seems unlikely. Many / most groups I have seen or attended or read to
>>> seem to have an agenda.
>>>
>>> Now and then people can't take it and don't come back because the
>>> aesthetic preference of the group is clear even if indefinable. But it
>>> is broad and it is wider than the insipid _linguistically innovative
>>> poetry_ which I have tried to love as a definition and cannot.
>>>
>>> We work on the inherited assumption that if there is anything to what
>>>
>> *one
>>
>>> does then others will respond. You can and always could comment, but
>>> you did it by saying _it might be even better if..._ or some such
>>>
>>> I think that is good pedagogy
>>>
>>>
>>> Just now I would say that everyone of the regulars is surprising us
>>> every time, and with a delight, and a different one every time, so
>>> that all you want to do is praise first. Then maybe comment.
>>>
>>> Publications can show other directions though wf is not publishing so
>>>
>> much
>>> nowadays as it once did. The occasional invitation can be directional
>>> but in a good way. It may be that everyone knows the invitee. If not,
>>> implicitly I am saying _listen to this_
>>>
>>> That's about it. People are welcome to attend without reading and
>>> some come wanting to be judged, feeling it seems that they have missed
>>> out unless a magister says _correct the following errors_
>>
>> Douglas Barbour
>> [log in to unmask]
>>
>> http://www.ualberta.ca/~dbarbour/
>> http://eclecticruckus.wordpress.com/
>>
>>
>> Latest books:
>> Continuations (with Sheila E Murphy)
>> http://www.uap.ualberta.ca/UAP.asp?LID=41&bookID=664
>> Wednesdays'
>>
>>
>> http://abovegroundpress.blogspot.com/2008/03/new-from-aboveground-press
>> _10.html
>>
>>
>> What dull barbarians are not proud of
>> their dullness and barbarism?
>>
>> Thackeray
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Andrew
> http://hispirits.blogspot.com/
> http://www.mullamullapress.com/QWERTY
> BLUE ROSE enovel avail. at Amazon, Smashwords and
> http://etextpress.com/books.htm
>
>


-----
UNFRAMED PICTURES by Lawrence Upton
42 pages; A5 paperback; colour cover
Writers Forum 978 1 84254 277 4
wfuk.org.uk/blog
----

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