My mistake, I should have said university education. I thought that was implied in the bit describing education as one of "the key remits of a university". That doesn't really apply to schools, more's the pity.
Impact outside the ivory towers is certainly important, some might say more important than most of the other "impacts" that count in REF2014.
MK
-----Original Message-----
From: psci-com: on public engagement with science [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Anthony Hardwicke
Sent: 2011-October-13 13:23
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] 'pathways to impact'
Dear Michael,
You say that researchers should look 'beyond research and education', but don't forget that impact should involve schools. Schools should be the main targets for public engagement because that is where the next generation of researchers is going to come from.
I would encourage science supervisors writing 'pathways to impact' proposals to go into local schools. The Association for Science Education have long played an active role in matching up researchers with schools.
all the best,
Anthony
Anthony Hardwicke
Head of Curriculum Development
T: 01707 288521
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-----Original Message-----
From: psci-com: on public engagement with science [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Michael Kenward
Sent: 11 October 2011 23:07
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] 'pathways to impact'
True, but it misses the point completely.
The whole idea of the current impact initiative, if you can call it that, is to look for the effects of universities outside the academic community and beyond research and education which are, after all, the key remits of a university. (Some universities also add "dissemination" as one of their three core activities.)
I mention this because too many of the claims of impact that I have seen from academics also fall into this trap. Education and training will not count as impact in REF2014, which will assess them in other bits of the process.
MK
-----Original Message-----
From: psci-com: on public engagement with science [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of D. R. Newman
Sent: 2011-October-11 13:11
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] 'pathways to impact'
One of the main ways research has had an impact in the past is when it is used to train the next generation: both in formal education, and from experience in research institutions. It is the spread of people with new skills and knowledge that lead to innovation clusters such as Silicon Valley or Ottawa: rather than research reports, patents or particular products.
However, as Michael Kenward wrote:
> As HEFCE puts it:
>
> "Case studies may include any social, economic or cultural impact or
> benefit beyond academia that has taken place during the assessment
> period, and was underpinned by excellent research produced by the
> submitting institution within a given timeframe."
Which makes it harder to use the impact of university teaching as a justification. Although what former students do is beyond academia, the impact may not be immediate.
Consider this edge case. Next year the Blavatnik School of Government at Oxford University is starting a new Masters in Public Policy, aimed at people who want to become leaders in government or policy wonks in 5 years. One of the core courses is in science and public policy. In it policy people will learn to think like scientists, and understand how scientists work and reason. Now research into game-based modelling of the economy and environment in the face of climate change would have a great impact on these students, and on the way they approach decisions once they are Permanent Secretaries. But would any of that count in a "pathways to impact" statement?
----
Dave Newman, shortly to become the learning technologist for this MPP.
www.e-consultation.org www.huwy.eu
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