JiscMail Logo
Email discussion lists for the UK Education and Research communities

Help for DATA-PROTECTION Archives


DATA-PROTECTION Archives

DATA-PROTECTION Archives


data-protection@JISCMAIL.AC.UK


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

DATA-PROTECTION Home

DATA-PROTECTION Home

DATA-PROTECTION  June 2011

DATA-PROTECTION June 2011

Options

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password

Subject:

Re: HMRC and personal data

From:

"SHQ - Gardiner, Lee" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

SHQ - Gardiner, Lee

Date:

Thu, 16 Jun 2011 14:15:29 +0100

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (453 lines)

Trish 

Hertfordshire's fine was for errors with a fax machine not email.

If you are thinking of the recent Surrey CC fine that was for email but for
ones sent to the wrong recipients and included recipients outside of the
council network such as care providers and made no mention of GCSX networks.

You can use the most secure network in the world but if you are dumb enough
to send stuff to the wrong people 3 times (and are warned about your
conduct) and do nothing to prevent it then you will rightly get fined.

Lee 


Lee Gardiner
Data Protection & Freedom of Information Officer

Operational Risk Management
Lancashire Fire & Rescue Service 
Service Headquarters
Garstang Road
Fulwood
Preston
PR2 3LH

01772 866903
07891 718879

[log in to unmask]



-----Original Message-----
From: Bailey, Trish [mailto:[log in to unmask]] 
Sent: 16 June 2011 14:07
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [data-protection] HMRC and personal data

Lee
That's what Hertfordshire C Council obviously relied on and unfortunately
they got out again hence the fine.


Many thanks
Trish
Trish-louise Bailey
Audit & Assurance (Information Governance) (IG covers:  Data Protection &
Privacy, FOI, Information Security, Information Sharing & Confidentiality,
Information & Records Management, Information Quality & Assurance) Telford &
Wrekin Council Civic Offices Coach Central Telford
TF3 4HD
www.telford.gov.uk

em:   [log in to unmask] or [log in to unmask]
tel:    01952 382537
mb:   07528 969455


-----Original Message-----
From: This list is for those interested in Data Protection issues
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of SHQ - Gardiner, Lee
Sent: 16 June 2011 13:42
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: HMRC and personal data

Nope but in theory by using a courier it is more likely to guarantee
delivery (as you can track its progress) than using 1st Class post.  It also
demonstrates that you are taking steps to (again in theory) guarantee
delivery and ensure the security of the information being sent (regardless
of format).

To be honest when public authorities, and especially councils, have spent
000's on GCSX connections so they can work with the DWP (and arguably share
more sensitive info on benefits etc electronically) why would HMRC ask for
electronic information via any other route?

Oh hang on they've already lost 28m records on a couple of CDs so it
couldn't possible happen again could it so what's the harm?

Lee Gardiner
Data Protection & Freedom of Information Officer

Operational Risk Management
Lancashire Fire & Rescue Service
Service Headquarters
Garstang Road
Fulwood
Preston
PR2 3LH

01772 866903
07891 718879

[log in to unmask]



-----Original Message-----
From: Jane Holden [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: 16 June 2011 13:31
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [data-protection] HMRC and personal data

Hmm seems inconsistent and a bit woolly to me.  Sending it by courier
doesn't stop an unauthorised person opening the envelope does it.  :-)




Jane Holden
Corporate Services Officer
Legal Services
Barrow-in-Furness Borough Council
Town Hall, Duke Street
Barrow-in-Furness
Cumbria  LA14 2LD
Tel:  01229 876452
Fax: 01229 876515





-----Original Message-----
From: This list is for those interested in Data Protection issues
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Lawrence Serewicz
Sent: 16 June 2011 13:19
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [data-protection] HMRC and personal data

Jane,
Good question. My first guess is that paper cannot be encrypted but a disk
can.  If you fail to encrypt the disk, even though you know the need, then
you can be seen not to have taken reasonable steps.

If there was a way to encrypt paper, as paper, then that would need to be
considered.  Ideally, if the information is sensitive personal (as opposed
to personal information) I would expect a courier service to demonstrate the
reasonable steps to keep information secure.

So far as I can see, the breaches and the fines have been around sensitive
personal information rather than just personal information.

Happy to be corrected.

Best,

Lawrence



-----Original Message-----
From: This list is for those interested in Data Protection issues
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Jane Holden
Sent: 16 June 2011 13:02
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [data-protection] HMRC and personal data

This is probably a really stupid question so forgive me but I'm at a loss to
see what the difference is between sending personal data in paper format via
post and an unencrypted disc?


Jane Holden
Corporate Services Officer
Legal Services
Barrow-in-Furness Borough Council
Town Hall, Duke Street
Barrow-in-Furness
Cumbria  LA14 2LD
Tel:  01229 876452
Fax: 01229 876515





-----Original Message-----
From: This list is for those interested in Data Protection issues
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bailey, Trish
Sent: 16 June 2011 12:56
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [data-protection] HMRC and personal data

Phil

Your obligation is to the organisation you are working for as in the "eyes"
of the law your org is the Data Controller and responsible for the transfer.
I would personally (as far as possible) insist on a form of encryption for
the transfer of data or alternatively (send it via Gov Connect - which would
not require the encryption of the actual information.

I would also be inclined to speak to ICO and explain your situation and ask
what they can advise.  Either way an acceptable method of transfer needs to
be reached (its not that you are not cooperating but your organisation has
obligations under DPA as well as everyone else).

I absolutely astonished that HRMC are operating in this manner - it would
appear lessons have not be learned.

Many thanks
Trish
Trish-louise Bailey
Audit & Assurance (Information Governance) (IG covers:  Data Protection &
Privacy, FOI, Information Security, Information Sharing & Confidentiality,
Information & Records Management, Information Quality & Assurance) Telford &
Wrekin Council Civic Offices Coach Central Telford
TF3 4HD
www.telford.gov.uk

em:   [log in to unmask] or [log in to unmask]
tel:    01952 382537
mb:   07528 969455

-----Original Message-----
From: This list is for those interested in Data Protection issues
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Phil Bradshaw
Sent: 15 June 2011 17:24
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: HMRC and personal data

I have been consulted by my payroll team.

I am told that HMRC require us to export P11d information (which from a tax
perspective is about mileage claims and includes staff personal data), and
this gets placed on floppy disk (cd's not allowed !)  and sent "via post" to
HMRC. As far as can be discerned there is no encryption being used. The HMRC
website says that the files must not be "compressed" - whatever that means -
and why, since there should never be any issues with lossless compression or
encryption as the "original"
file can be duplicated.

Has anyone come across this. I am amazed, in view of history, that HMRC
sanction this. I am still trying to get chapter & verse from HMRC but they
are rather unresponsive at the moment. I can of course use a traceable
courier service if it would place us in breach of our tax obligations to
delay the info. , but even that places me in breach of our own policy which
is now quite clear : "where possible avoid the use of removable media for
the storage or transfer of personal data and where this is not possible use
an appropriate level of encryption ".

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     All archives of messages are stored permanently and are
      available to the world wide web community at large at
      http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/data-protection.html
     If you wish to leave this list please send the command
       leave data-protection to [log in to unmask] All user commands
can be found at http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/help/commandref.htm
 Any queries about sending or receiving messages please send to the list
owner
              [log in to unmask]
  Full help Desk - please email [log in to unmask] describing your
needs
        To receive these emails in HTML format send the command:
         SET data-protection HTML to [log in to unmask]
   (all commands go to [log in to unmask] not the list please)
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this email in error please notify the originator of the
message.

Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender,
except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the
views of Telford & Wrekin Council.

The content of this email has been automatically checked in conjunction with
the relevant policies of Telford & Wrekin Council.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     All archives of messages are stored permanently and are
      available to the world wide web community at large at
      http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/data-protection.html
     If you wish to leave this list please send the command
       leave data-protection to [log in to unmask] All user commands
can be found at http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/help/commandref.htm
 Any queries about sending or receiving messages please send to the list
owner
              [log in to unmask]
  Full help Desk - please email [log in to unmask] describing your
needs
        To receive these emails in HTML format send the command:
         SET data-protection HTML to [log in to unmask]
   (all commands go to [log in to unmask] not the list please)
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Barrow Borough Council - Enhancing the economic and social future of the
Borough.

Think - UK businesses use 2 million tonnes of paper each year - do you
really need to print this e-mail?

This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any view or
opinions presented are solely of the author and do not necessarily represent
those of Barrow Borough Council.
If you are not the intended recipient you may not use, disclose, distribute,
copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If you have received this e-mail in
error please contact the sender.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     All archives of messages are stored permanently and are
      available to the world wide web community at large at
      http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/data-protection.html
     If you wish to leave this list please send the command
       leave data-protection to [log in to unmask] All user commands
can be found at http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/help/commandref.htm
 Any queries about sending or receiving messages please send to the list
owner
              [log in to unmask]
  Full help Desk - please email [log in to unmask] describing your
needs
        To receive these emails in HTML format send the command:
         SET data-protection HTML to [log in to unmask]
   (all commands go to [log in to unmask] not the list please)
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Help protect our environment by only printing this email if absolutely
necessary. The information it contains and any files transmitted with it are
confidential and are only intended for the person or organisation to whom it
is addressed. It may be unlawful for you to use, share or copy the
information, if you are not authorised to do so. If you receive this email
by mistake, please inform the person who sent it at the above address and
then delete the email from your system. Durham County Council takes
reasonable precautions to ensure that its emails are virus free. However, we
do not accept responsibility for any losses incurred as a result of viruses
we might transmit and recommend that you should use your own virus checking
procedures.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     All archives of messages are stored permanently and are
      available to the world wide web community at large at
      http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/data-protection.html
     If you wish to leave this list please send the command
       leave data-protection to [log in to unmask] All user commands
can be found at http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/help/commandref.htm
 Any queries about sending or receiving messages please send to the list
owner
              [log in to unmask]
  Full help Desk - please email [log in to unmask] describing your
needs
        To receive these emails in HTML format send the command:
         SET data-protection HTML to [log in to unmask]
   (all commands go to [log in to unmask] not the list please)
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     All archives of messages are stored permanently and are
      available to the world wide web community at large at
      http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/data-protection.html
     If you wish to leave this list please send the command
       leave data-protection to [log in to unmask] All user commands
can be found at http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/help/commandref.htm
 Any queries about sending or receiving messages please send to the list
owner
              [log in to unmask]
  Full help Desk - please email [log in to unmask] describing your
needs
        To receive these emails in HTML format send the command:
         SET data-protection HTML to [log in to unmask]
   (all commands go to [log in to unmask] not the list please)
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

********************
This e-mail contains information intended for the addressee only.
It may be confidential and may be the subject of legal and/or professional
privilege.
If you are not the addressee you are not authorised to disseminate,
distribute, copy or use this e-mail or any attachment to it The content may
be personal or contain personal opinions and unless specifically stated or
followed up in writing, the content cannot be taken to form a contract or to
be an expression of Lancashire Fire and Rescue Service's position.
Lancashire Fire and Rescue Service reserves the right to monitor all
incoming and outgoing email Lancashire Fire and Rescue Service has taken
reasonable steps to ensure that outgoing communications do not contain
malicious software and it is your responsibility to carry out any checks on
this email before accepting the email and opening attachments.

********************
GET OUT - STAY OUT - CALL THE FIRE SERVICE OUT
********************

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     All archives of messages are stored permanently and are
      available to the world wide web community at large at
      http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/data-protection.html
     If you wish to leave this list please send the command
       leave data-protection to [log in to unmask] All user commands
can be found at http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/help/commandref.htm
 Any queries about sending or receiving messages please send to the list
owner
              [log in to unmask]
  Full help Desk - please email [log in to unmask] describing your
needs
        To receive these emails in HTML format send the command:
         SET data-protection HTML to [log in to unmask]
   (all commands go to [log in to unmask] not the list please)
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this email in error please notify the originator of the
message. 

Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender,
except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the
views of Telford & Wrekin Council.

The content of this email has been automatically checked in conjunction with
the relevant policies of Telford & Wrekin Council.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     All archives of messages are stored permanently and are
      available to the world wide web community at large at
      http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/data-protection.html
     If you wish to leave this list please send the command
       leave data-protection to [log in to unmask]
All user commands can be found at
http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/help/commandref.htm
 Any queries about sending or receiving messages please send to the list
owner
              [log in to unmask]
  Full help Desk - please email [log in to unmask] describing your
needs
        To receive these emails in HTML format send the command:
         SET data-protection HTML to [log in to unmask]
   (all commands go to [log in to unmask] not the list please)
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     All archives of messages are stored permanently and are
      available to the world wide web community at large at
      http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/data-protection.html
     If you wish to leave this list please send the command
       leave data-protection to [log in to unmask]
All user commands can be found at http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/help/commandref.htm
 Any queries about sending or receiving messages please send to the list owner
              [log in to unmask]
  Full help Desk - please email [log in to unmask] describing your needs
        To receive these emails in HTML format send the command:
         SET data-protection HTML to [log in to unmask]
   (all commands go to [log in to unmask] not the list please)
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

JiscMail Tools


RSS Feeds and Sharing


Advanced Options


Archives

December 2019
November 2019
October 2019
September 2019
August 2019
July 2019
June 2019
May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
2006
2005
2004
2003
2002
2001
2000
1999
1998


JiscMail is a Jisc service.

View our service policies at https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/ and Jisc's privacy policy at https://www.jisc.ac.uk/website/privacy-notice

Secured by F-Secure Anti-Virus CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager