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WELSH-TERMAU-CYMRAEG  December 2010

WELSH-TERMAU-CYMRAEG December 2010

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Subject:

Re: Erthygl ar gyfieithu peirianyddol

From:

Delyth Prys <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Discussion of Welsh language technical terminology and vocabulary <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 22 Dec 2010 16:48:01 +0000

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (391 lines)

Quoting "Saunders, Tim" <[log in to unmask]>:

> Diolch. Diddorol iawn. Beth yw rhagolygon cael ychwanegu deddfwriaeth,
> Cylchlythyrau, ayyb, at y corpws?

Os mai son am gorpws Google wyt ti, mae Google yn ychwanegu ato drwy  
grafu'r we am ddeunyddiau Cymraeg - gall unrhyw beth syd ar y we fynd  
iddo felly.

Ond fe roddodd Dafydd Jones ac Andreas Eisne gofnod y Cynulliad (fel  
yr oedd bryd hynny) mewn corpws cyfochrog sydd wedi bod yn ddefnyddiol  
iawn at nifer o ddibenion. Hwn fyddwn ni yn ei ddefnyddio fel cof  
parod ar gyfer ein rhaglen arddangos. Mae datblygiadau eraill ar y  
gweill hefyd, gobeithio y byddwn ni'n medru adrodd mwy ar hyn yn y  
flwyddyn newydd,

Delyth

>
> Yn iach,
>
>
> Tim
>
>
> Tim Saunders
> Cyfieithydd Translator
> Cyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Rhondda Cynon Taf Rhondda Cynon Taf County
> Borough Council
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Discussion of Welsh language technical terminology and vocabulary
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Delyth Prys
> Sent: 22 December 2010 14:24
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Erthygl ar gyfieithu peirianyddol
>
> Efallai fod yr erthygl wreiddiol braidd yn gamarweiniol. Nid yw
> cywiriadau i gyfieithu peirianyddol Google yn dychwelyd yn syth i'r
> canlyniadau chwilio, ac nid yw deunydd newydd yn mynd yn syth i gof
> cyfieithu, ond yn hytrach i gorpws anferth sy'n sail i'r cyfieithu, gan
> ddefnyddio dulliau ystadegol i greu cyfeiithiad peirianyddol.
> Er hynny, mae'n deg rhoi rhybudd hefyd i gyfieithwyr sy'n defnyddio
> Google Translate rhag iddynt ollwng deunydd cyfrinachol o'u llaw (drwy
> ddefnyddio Google i'w frasgyfieithu) ac i hynny godi rywdro fel cynnig
> mewn cyfieithiad periainyddol.
> Ar y llaw arall rydyn ni'n defnyddio cyfieithu peirianyddol Google yn
> ein rhaglen arddangos newydd yn y project CAT Cymru i gynnig
> brasgyfieithiad o fewn rhaglen cof cyfieithu lle nad oes cynnig arall yn
> y cof.
> Bydd David Chan yn rhoi papur ar hyn yn ein cynhadledd fis Ionawr (gw.
> CATcymru.org) a bydd co bach am ddim ar gael i bawb sy'n mynychu'r
> gynhadledd yn cynnwys rhaglen cof cyfieithu, cof parod wedi'i lwytho
> iddo, geiriadur termau integredig a gwirydd sillafu integredig o fewn y
> rhaglen (sori, hysbyseb arall i'ch denu chi i'r gynhadledd yn fan
> 'na!)
>
> Delyth
>
>
>
>
>
> Quoting Ann Corkett <[log in to unmask]>:
>
>> <A byddai ychwanegu cofau holl gyfieithwyr y wlad yn gryn gaffaeliad
>>
>>
>>
>> Byddai'n dda gwneud hynny *o gael* staff llawn amser wrthi'n gwirio
>> ansawdd a safoni termau!  Byddaf innau'n dal i gaboli fy nghof
>> cyfieithu yng ngoleuni profiad.
>>
>>
>>
>> Hefyd byddai'n rhaid *peidio* a newid cyfeiriad unrhyw gof.
>>
>>
>>
>> Ann
>>
>>   _____
>>
>> From: Discussion of Welsh language technical terminology and
>> vocabulary [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
>> Saunders, Tim
>> Sent: 22 December 2010 10:50
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: Erthygl ar gyfieithu peirianyddol
>>
>>
>>
>> O fewn ei gyfyngiadau anochel, gall cyfieithu peiriant fod yn offeryn
>> defnyddiol. Ar lefel brawddegau unigol - a hynny drwy ddamwain a hap
>> yn aml
>> - gall y broses roi cynnig defnyddiol - ond cynnig a all fod yn eithaf
>
>> peryglus hefyd. Nid yw Google Translate yn cynnig rhyw hud a lledrith
>> fydd yn datrys ein problemau cyfathrebu i gyd: caf deimlad pendant fod
>
>> rhywrai sydd heb ddeall hynny.
>>
>>
>>
>> Bydd fe fydd yn rhoi syniad go lew i rai sy'n deall digon o gefndir y
>> ddogfen a'i chyd-destun. Ond. fel ag y mae ar hyn o bryd, ni fuaswn
>> i'n fodlon dibynnu ar y broses. Cof gennyf gyfaill o'r Dwyrain Canol a
>
>> redodd wynebddalen Al-Jazeera drwy feddalwedd gyfieithu
>> Arabeg-Saesneg, a chael hanes dau fyfyriwr oedd yn creu helbul yn
>> Affganistan! (Meddyliwch amdano
>> ...) Pe bawn i'n mynd at gyfieithydd masnachol am drosiad o ddogfen
>> mewn iaith nad oeddwn yn ei medru, a chlywed ei b/fod wedi dibynnu ar
>> Google Translate, byddwn i'n ystyried hyn yn dor-contract ac yn troi
>> at gyfieithydd dibynadwy.
>>
>>
>>
>> Wedi dweud hynny, mae'r syniad o gof cyfieithu i bawb yn syniad eithaf
>
>> apelgar. Mewn gwirionedd, mae arnom ni angen rhyw fath o Garreg
>> Rosetta electronig. Un cam hanfodol fyddai bwydo holl ddeddfwriaeth y
>> Cynulliad i mewn, gyda Chylchlythyrau, Canllawiau, Cyfarwyddiadau,
>> Codau, a dogfennau cyffelyb i ddilyn. A byddai ychwanegu cofau holl
>> gyfieithwyr y wlad yn gryn gaffaeliad.
>>
>>
>>
>> Yn iach,
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Tim
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Tim Saunders
>>
>> Cyfieithydd Translator
>>
>> Cyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Rhondda Cynon Taf Rhondda Cynon Taf County
>> Borough Council
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>   _____
>>
>> From: Discussion of Welsh language technical terminology and
>> vocabulary [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
>> Neil Shadrach
>> Sent: 22 December 2010 10:25
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: Erthygl ar gyfieithu peirianyddol
>>
>> Mae Google Translate yn cynnig y canlynol ( sy'n eithaf agos ):
>>
>> "Amen and amen. In other words, engineers have managed to
>> mechanization botched translation."
>>
>> Rwy wedi bod yn eithaf negyddol tuag at y syniad yn y gorffennol ond
>> mae yn gwella ac mae cynnig presennol Google yn aml yn eithaf da gyda
>> geiriau ac ymadroddion byr ( ac mae'n rhoi'r acenion mewn ). Dyw e
>> ddim yn cyfieithu un gair ar y tro fel roedd o'r blaen yn mynd am
>> ddarnau hirach. Mewn ffordd mae'n rhyw fath o gof cyfieithu i bawb.
>> Byddai'n dda iawn gweld rhai o'r rhestrau termau yn cael eu bwydo
> mewn.
>>
>>
>>
>> Rwy wedi arbrofi ychydig gyda chyfieithu tudalennau newyddion ar y we
>> mewn ieithoedd gwahanol ac fel arfer mae'n ddigon da i ddeall beth
> sy'n digwydd.
>> Does dim rhai i gyfieithiad bod yn berffaith i fod yn ddefnyddiol mewn
>
>> llawer o achosion. I rywun sy'n dysgu iaith er enghraifft gallai fod o
>
>> gymorth ac yn llawer llai diflas na throi at y geiriadur cant o
>> weithiau er mwyn darllen darn bach.
>>
>>
>>
>> Does dim angen peiriant i greu cyfieithiad carbwl :)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 2010/12/22 Saunders, Tim <[log in to unmask]>
>>
>> Amen ac amen. Mewn geiriau eraill, mae peirianwyr wedi llwyddo i
>> fecaneiddio cyfieithu carbwl.
>>
>>
>>
>> Yn iach,
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Tim
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Tim Saunders
>>
>> Cyfieithydd Translator
>>
>> Cyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Rhondda Cynon Taf Rhondda Cynon Taf County
>> Borough Council
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>   _____
>>
>> From: Discussion of Welsh language technical terminology and
>> vocabulary [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
>> Claire Richards
>> Sent: 21 December 2010 16:25
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Erthygl ar gyfieithu peirianyddol
>>
>> Roedd erthygl hir a diddorol yn yr Observer ddydd Sul am gyfieithu
>> peirianyddol.
>>
>>
>>
>> Mae ar gael ar lein ar
>>
>> http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2010/dec/19/google-translate-comp
>> uters-
>> languages?INTCMP=SRCH
>>
>>
>>
>> Claire
>>
>>
>>
>> Mae Pennawd Cyf yn gwmni cyfyngedig wedi'i gofrestru yng Nghymru a
>> Lloegr o dan y rhif cofrestru 4276774, a chyfeiriad y swyddfa
>> gofrestredig yw 53 Heol yr Orsaf, Ystum Taf, Caerdydd, CF14 2FB.
>>
>>
>>
>> Pennawd Cyf is a limited company registered in England and Wales under
>
>> the number 4276774, and the address of the registered office is 53
>> Station Road, Llandaff North, Cardiff, CF14 2FB.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> This transmission is intended for the named addressee(s) only and may
>> contain sensitive or protectively marked material up to RESTRICTED and
>
>> should be handled accordingly. Unless you are the named addressee (or
>> authorised to receive it for the addressee) you may not copy or use
>> it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you have received this
>> transmission in error please notify the sender immediately. All
>> traffic including GCSx may be subject to recording and/or monitoring
>> in accordance with relevant legislation
>>
>> For the full disclaimer please access
>> <http://www.rctcbc.gov.uk/disclaimer>
>> http://www.rctcbc.gov.uk/disclaimer
>>
>>
>>
>> Mae'r neges ar gyfer y person(au) a enwyd yn unig a gall gynnwys
>> deunydd sensitif neu ddeunydd sy wedi'i farcio hyd at 'CYFYNGEDIG' a
>> dylid ei thrin yn unol a hynny. Os nad chi yw'r person a enwyd (neu os
>
>> nad oes gyda chi'r awdurdod i'w derbyn ar ran y person a enwyd) chewch
>
>> chi ddim ei chopio neu'i defnyddio, neu'i datgelu i berson arall. Os
>> ydych wedi derbyn y neges ar gam a wnewch roi gwybod i'r sawl sy wedi
>> anfon y neges ar unwaith. Mae modd cofnodi a/neu fonitro holl
>> negeseuon GCSX yn unol a'r ddeddfwriaeth berthnasol.
>>
>> I weld yr ymwadiad llawn ewch i http://
>> <http://www.rctcbc.gov.uk/ymwadiad>
>> www.rctcbc.gov.uk/ymwadiad
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> This transmission is intended for the named addressee(s) only and may
>> contain sensitive or protectively marked material up to RESTRICTED and
>
>> should be handled accordingly. Unless you are the named addressee (or
>> authorised to receive it for the addressee) you may not copy or use
>> it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you have received this
>> transmission in error please notify the sender immediately. All
>> traffic including GCSx may be subject to recording and/or monitoring
>> in accordance with relevant legislation
>>
>> For the full disclaimer please access
>> <http://www.rctcbc.gov.uk/disclaimer>
>> http://www.rctcbc.gov.uk/disclaimer
>>
>>
>>
>> Mae'r neges ar gyfer y person(au) a enwyd yn unig a gall gynnwys
>> deunydd sensitif neu ddeunydd sy wedi'i farcio hyd at 'CYFYNGEDIG' a
>> dylid ei thrin yn unol a hynny. Os nad chi yw'r person a enwyd (neu os
>
>> nad oes gyda chi'r awdurdod i'w derbyn ar ran y person a enwyd) chewch
>
>> chi ddim ei chopio neu'i defnyddio, neu'i datgelu i berson arall. Os
>> ydych wedi derbyn y neges ar gam a wnewch roi gwybod i'r sawl sy wedi
>> anfon y neges ar unwaith. Mae modd cofnodi a/neu fonitro holl
>> negeseuon GCSX yn unol a'r ddeddfwriaeth berthnasol.
>>
>> I weld yr ymwadiad llawn ewch i http://
>> <http://www.rctcbc.gov.uk/ymwadiad>
>> www.rctcbc.gov.uk/ymwadiad
>>
>>
>>
>>   _____
>>
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 1435/3330 - Release Date:
>> 12/21/10
>>
>>
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program.
>
>
>
> This transmission is intended for the named addressee(s) only and   
> may contain sensitive or protectively marked material up to   
> RESTRICTED and should be handled accordingly. Unless you are the   
> named addressee (or authorised to receive it for the addressee) you   
> may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you have   
> received this transmission in error please notify the sender   
> immediately. All traffic including GCSx may be subject to recording   
> and/or monitoring in accordance with relevant legislation
>
> For the full disclaimer please access http://www.rctcbc.gov.uk/disclaimer
>
>
>
> Mae'r neges ar gyfer y person(au) a enwyd yn unig a gall gynnwys   
> deunydd sensitif neu ddeunydd sy wedi'i farcio hyd at 'CYFYNGEDIG' a  
>  dylid ei thrin yn unol a hynny. Os nad chi yw'r person a enwyd (neu  
>  os nad oes gyda chi'r awdurdod i'w derbyn ar ran y person a enwyd)   
> chewch chi ddim ei chopio neu'i defnyddio, neu'i datgelu i berson   
> arall. Os ydych wedi derbyn y neges ar gam a wnewch roi gwybod i'r   
> sawl sy wedi anfon y neges ar unwaith. Mae modd cofnodi a/neu   
> fonitro holl negeseuon GCSX yn unol a'r ddeddfwriaeth berthnasol.
> I weld yr ymwadiad llawn ewch i http://www.rctcbc.gov.uk/ymwadiad
>



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