I strongly agree that rhyme and form are not synonymous. But I will point
out that rhyme is a component of classical ghazal, and that many people
recognize no other sort aa a ghazal.
Also, the refrain characteristic of even a highly idiosyncratic ghazal means
it's rarely something I'd call free verse.
--Uche
On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 4:18 PM, John Cunningham
<[log in to unmask]>wrote:
> Just for clarification, in my opinion rhyme and form are not synonymous. A
> ghazal is a form but has been used almost exclusively as a free verse
> form
> in English speaking countries.
> John Herbert Cunningham
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Poetryetc: poetry and poetics [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On
> Behalf Of Uche Ogbuji
> Sent: June-23-10 5:05 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Lewis Turco Feature
>
> Of course you can call anything form. I've already mentioned the alphabet,
> phonetics, and such.
>
> I think everyone knows what I mean in this particular discussion when I say
> "form." So far the discussion has not suffered from anyone's playing games
> with the term.
>
> --Uche
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 3:57 PM, Alison Croggon <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
>
> > Dr Seuss was my first formative influence. When I read him to my kids,
> > I realised how fabulously inventive he is.
> >
> > There's no such thing as formless poetry. The concept makes absolutely
> > no sense to me. I don't understand why form only applies to rhyme:
> > Douglas has mentioned Pound, one of the great workers of form in the
> > last century. Maybe only Auden challenges him in terms of prosodic
> > control. (Try writing lines like that). I'm sure that's why Frost
> > admired him.
> >
> > I'm not sure whether art is possible without the tensions of
> > constraint. What's boring, with any form, is when a practitioner only
> > works within his/her chosen form, and doesn't struggle against it.
> >
> > xA
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:13 AM, Douglas Barbour
> > <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> > > On 23-Jun-10, at 1:01 PM, Uche Ogbuji wrote:
> > >>>
> > >> So do you find most poets writing in free verse not boring?
> > >
> > > Didnt say that, Uche; a lot of them are.
> > >>
> > >> I find it hard to credit that Dr. Seuss's work ever came close to
> > breaking
> > >> the constraints of the alphabet.
> > >>
> > >> It would be like calling Shakespeare a free verser every time he used
> > >> catalexis.
> > >
> > > just a little joke there...
> > >
> > > on the other hand, Olson has an essay on Shakespeare that's very
> > > interesting....
> > >
> > > I take Catherine's points seriously. There are some poets for whom the
> > trad
> > > forms are freeing, & lead to relevation, but for many they do not (not
> to
> > > say that just writing another free verse lyric so conventionalis any
> > > better).
> > >
> > > But I will stick with Creeley's take on that, & also (although it's for
> > > prose too) Delany's ('Put in opposition to "style," there is no such
> > thing
> > > as "content.")
> > >
> > > Okay, I love aphoristic takes...
> > >
> > > Doug
> > > Douglas Barbour
> > > [log in to unmask]
> > >
> > > http://www.ualberta.ca/~dbarbour/<http://www.ualberta.ca/%7Edbarbour/><
> http://www.ualberta.ca/%7Edbarbour/>
> > >
> > > Latest books:
> > > Continuations (with Sheila E Murphy)
> > > http://www.uap.ualberta.ca/UAP.asp?LID=41&bookID=664
> > > Wednesdays'
> > >
> >
>
> http://abovegroundpress.blogspot.com/2008/03/new-from-aboveground-press_10.h
> tml<http://abovegroundpress.blogspot.com/2008/03/new-from-aboveground-press_10.h%0Atml>
> > >
> > > because I want to die
> > >
> > > writing Haiku
> > >
> > > or, better,
> > >
> > > long lines, clean and syllabic as knotted bamboo. Yes!
> > >
> > > Phyllis Webb
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Editor, Masthead: http://www.masthead.net.au
> > Blog: http://theatrenotes.blogspot.com
> > Home page: http://www.alisoncroggon.com
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Uche Ogbuji http://uche.ogbuji.net
> Weblog: http://copia.ogbuji.net
> Poetry ed @TNB: http://www.thenervousbreakdown.com/author/uogbuji/
> Founding Partner, Zepheira http://zepheira.com
> Linked-in: http://www.linkedin.com/in/ucheogbuji
> Articles: http://uche.ogbuji.net/tech/publications/
> Friendfeed: http://friendfeed.com/uche
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/uogbuji
> http://www.google.com/profiles/uche.ogbuji
>
--
Uche Ogbuji http://uche.ogbuji.net
Weblog: http://copia.ogbuji.net
Poetry ed @TNB: http://www.thenervousbreakdown.com/author/uogbuji/
Founding Partner, Zepheira http://zepheira.com
Linked-in: http://www.linkedin.com/in/ucheogbuji
Articles: http://uche.ogbuji.net/tech/publications/
Friendfeed: http://friendfeed.com/uche
Twitter: http://twitter.com/uogbuji
http://www.google.com/profiles/uche.ogbuji
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