I think my subsequent post covers this. Maybe you 
should say what's B&I about the conceptual. I for 
one have no idea what's going on in that regard in the UK and Ireland.

Mark

At 02:45 PM 10/2/2009, you wrote:
>Perfectly clear, and rather summarily 
>proscriptive. My question, clear too: what's not 
>"British and Irish" about the "conceptual"?
>
>
>On Fri, 2 Oct 2009, Mark Weiss wrote:
>
>>Wrong venue for the discussion, as it has 
>>nothing to do with British and Irish poetry. 
>>There are also lots of more appropriate venues to which anyone can subscribe.
>>
>>I should have thought that my meaning would be 
>>clear. It's not a particularly complex concept.
>>
>>Mark
>>
>>At 01:58 PM 10/2/2009, you wrote:
>>>How, I wonder, could the "conceptual" have a "venue"?
>>>
>>>On Fri, 2 Oct 2009, Mark Weiss wrote:
>>>
>>>>It's simply the wrong venue.
>>>>At 01:13 PM 10/2/2009, you wrote:
>>>>>Mark, Kent suggested I post a few things for him. I won't post any more
>>>>>on this topic, given the lukewarm response.
>>>>>On Fri, 2 Oct 2009 09:48:59 -0400, Mark Weiss
>>>>><[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>>> >Jeff: This is an awful lot of posts about
>>>>> >something incredibly trivial and at best mildly
>>>>> >amusing. It's also entirely divorced from British
>>>>> >and Irish poetry. Anyone here who wants to follow
>>>>> >the discussion could do so at poetryetc, where
>>>>> >you've been posting the identical posts. If
>>>>> >Britpo slides back into silence for a while, so
>>>>> >what? You may have noticed that almost nobody
>>>>> >here shows evidence of being interested, except
>>>>> >for a couple of Americans who are also on poetryetc.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >Mark
>>>>> >
>>>>> >At 07:11 AM 10/2/2009, you wrote:
>>>>> >>Kent asked me to post this response to someone on the Digital
>>>>> >>Emunction blog:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>"OK, Bren­nen, but if it isn’t, then what is it I might
>>>>>have “plagiarized”?
>>>>> >>I’m not saying I haven’t, I’m just curi­ous what you mean.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>I see that you are think­ing about this at your blog in terms of recent
>>>>>art
>>>>> >>his­tory and theory, quot­ing Danto, and I think that’s great (Kenny
>>>>> >>should think it’s great, too, since he’s 
>>>>> sup­pos­edly all about reflec­tion
>>>>> >>and dis­cus­sion).
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>In their writ­ings on the Duchampian ready­made and its neo-avant-
>>>>>garde
>>>>> >>recy­clings, I find crit­ics like Buchloh 
>>>>> and Foster more inter­est­ing than
>>>>> >>Danto. Though they take strong excep­tion to Burger’s whole­sale dis­
>>>>> >>missal of the neo-avant-garde, they’re also very crit­i­cal of ways the
>>>>> >>great, orig­i­nal ready­made move has been cut and pasted ad infini­tum
>>>>> >>into the art market since, say, Nou­veau real­isme­ recy­cled ges­tures
>>>>> >>with this or that generic tweak or nov­elty, that is, emp­tied of any
>>>>>rad­i­
>>>>> >>cal, anti-&#8203;institutional charge­
>>>>> >>ready-&#8203;made, as it were, for rapid cap­ture
>>>>> >>and incor­po­ra­tion by the net­works of “Museum Culture.”
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>This recy­cling, I’d say, is trans­par­ently the case with the work of
>>>>>Kenny
>>>>> >>Gold­smith (Gold­smith and Bok, to be sure, who despite their
>>>>>polemics
>>>>> >>for the ben­e­fits of ego-&#8203;less
>>>>> >>“uncreativity” seem to have been drunk for
>>>>> >>the past few years on some kind of secret Author Func­tion Ego Juice,
>>>>> >>are quite exu­ber­antly open about their desire for the Museum). KG’s
>>>>> >>work is “uncreative” and “boring” not 
>>>>> just as affec­tive exten­sion of its
>>>>> >>pro­claimed poetic and “ontological” premises; it’s uncre­ative and
>>>>>boring
>>>>> >>because it’s so damn old hat: an attempted
>>>>> >>impor­ta­tion of decades-&#8203;old
>>>>> >>ges­tures into a Po-&#8203;Biz scene that, as
>>>>> >>Gold­smith him­self puts it, “is forty
>>>>> >>years behind art,” and thus likely (at least part of its crowd) to take
>>>>> >>his “conceptual” banal­i­ties as 
>>>>> excit­ing and new. In some cir­cles, they
>>>>> >>call it snake oil.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>But it’s MY Day, Bren­nen, that is truly new, you see. The Authen­tic
>>>>> >>Item. Because no one has ever done it quite like this before. I’ve
>>>>>taken
>>>>> >>his whole bookum and made it mine, in single deci­sive act. And doing
>>>>> >>so, I’ve put his pla­gia­rized bookum into the
>>>>> >>dust­bin of sub-&#8203;poetic sub-&#8203;
>>>>> >>history. I am being both funny and 
>>>>> seri­ous, in saying that. Dou­bled in
>>>>> >>my intent, so to speak, like the red-&#8203;hot “Doubled K” poker
>>>>>that K.
>>>>> >>dream­ily men­tions in his blurb to my Day, where he acknowl­edges
>>>>>me,
>>>>> >>his mir­rored K, as his master. And it’s why he’s going to put my book
>>>>>up
>>>>> >>on UbuWeb.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>And one more thing, though here I’m not kid­ding around: What they
>>>>> >>call “Conceptual poetry”? It’s forty years behind Broodthaers and
>>>>>Insti­tu­
>>>>> >>tional Cri­tique.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>Kent"
>>>>> >
>>>>> >Announcing The Whole Island: Six Decades of Cuban
>>>>> >Poetry (University of California Press).
>>>>> >Forthcoming in November 2009 2009.
>>>>> >To read more go to: http://go.ucpress.edu/WholeIsland
>>>>> >
>>>>> >"The Whole Island is a masterwork of cartography:
>>>>> >a map of what is, for English-language readers,
>>>>> >an almost unexplored territory, full of poets--at
>>>>> >home and in the diaspora--whom we ought to know."
>>>>> >                                    -Eliot
>>>>> >Weinberger
>>>>> >
>>>>> >"A definitive anthology guiding curious poets,
>>>>> >literary scholars and teachers, and generations of
>>>>> >readers out of the shadow of ignorant,
>>>>> >imperialist 'lockdown' surrounding the breadth and power of
>>>>> >Cuban poetry. [Weiss] provides a salient,
>>>>> >comprehensive introduction covering the fascinating vidas
>>>>> >of individual poets, literary movements,
>>>>> >political exigencies, and the vicissitudes of an ongoing cultural
>>>>> >struggle. But the imagination of the poetry
>>>>> >rules. What emerges is an essential compendium to
>>>>> >world literature. Presente!"
>>>>> >                                    -Anne
>>>>> >Waldman
>>>>Announcing The Whole Island: Six Decades of 
>>>>Cuban Poetry (University of California Press).
>>>>Forthcoming in November 2009 2009.
>>>>To read more go to: http://go.ucpress.edu/WholeIsland
>>>>"The Whole Island is a masterwork of 
>>>>cartography: a map of what is, for English-language readers,
>>>>an almost unexplored territory, full of 
>>>>poets--at home and in the diaspora--whom we ought to know."
>>>>-Eliot Weinberger
>>>>"A definitive anthology guiding curious 
>>>>poets, literary scholars and teachers, and generations of
>>>>readers out of the shadow of ignorant, 
>>>>imperialist 'lockdown' surrounding the breadth and power of
>>>>Cuban poetry. [Weiss] provides a salient, 
>>>>comprehensive introduction covering the fascinating vidas
>>>>of individual poets, literary movements, 
>>>>political exigencies, and the vicissitudes of an ongoing cultural
>>>>struggle. But the imagination of the poetry 
>>>>rules. What emerges is an essential compendium to
>>>>world literature. Presente!"
>>>>-Anne Waldman
>>>Announcing The Whole Island: Six Decades of 
>>>Cuban Poetry (University of California Press).
>>>Forthcoming in November 2009 2009.
>>>To read more go to: http://go.ucpress.edu/WholeIsland
>>>"The Whole Island is a masterwork of 
>>>cartography: a map of what is, for English-language readers,
>>>an almost unexplored territory, full of 
>>>poets--at home and in the diaspora--whom we ought to know."
>>>-Eliot Weinberger
>>>"A definitive anthology guiding curious poets, 
>>>literary scholars and teachers, and generations of
>>>readers out of the shadow of ignorant, 
>>>imperialist 'lockdown' surrounding the breadth and power of
>>>Cuban poetry. [Weiss] provides a salient, 
>>>comprehensive introduction covering the fascinating vidas
>>>of individual poets, literary movements, 
>>>political exigencies, and the vicissitudes of an ongoing cultural
>>>struggle. But the imagination of the poetry 
>>>rules. What emerges is an essential compendium to
>>>world literature. Presente!"
>>>-Anne Waldman
>>
>>
>
>Announcing The Whole Island: Six Decades of 
>Cuban Poetry (University of California Press).
>Forthcoming in November 2009 2009.
>To read more go to: http://go.ucpress.edu/WholeIsland
>
>"The Whole Island is a masterwork of 
>cartography: a map of what is, for English-language readers,
>an almost unexplored territory, full of 
>poets--at home and in the diaspora--whom we ought to know."
> 
>-Eliot Weinberger
>
>"A definitive anthology guiding curious poets, 
>literary scholars and teachers, and generations of
>readers out of the shadow of ignorant, 
>imperialist 'lockdown' surrounding the breadth and power of
>Cuban poetry. [Weiss] provides a salient, 
>comprehensive introduction covering the fascinating vidas
>of individual poets, literary movements, 
>political exigencies, and the vicissitudes of an ongoing cultural
>struggle. But the imagination of the poetry 
>rules. What emerges is an essential compendium to
>world literature. Presente!"
> 
>-Anne Waldman