JiscMail Logo
Email discussion lists for the UK Education and Research communities

Help for CCP4BB Archives


CCP4BB Archives

CCP4BB Archives


CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

CCP4BB Home

CCP4BB Home

CCP4BB  April 2009

CCP4BB April 2009

Options

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password

Subject:

Re: Reason for Neglected X-ray Fluorescence

From:

James Holton <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

James Holton <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 24 Apr 2009 11:59:58 +1000

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (84 lines)

Dirk Kostrewa wrote:
> yes, this is certainly true for real fluorescence effects. But the 
> anomalous scattering can be best thought of as a resonance phenomenon 
> without any frequency change, and as such, it has a distinct phase 
> relationship to the elastically scattered photon and does have an 
> effect on the intensities (which, I think, was the background of the 
> original question?). But for the lighter atoms in biological 
> macromolecules, where in a typical experiment the measurement 
> frequency is far away from any resonance frequency, this effect can be 
> neglected.
>
> This leads me to my follow-up question to the experts: why is the 
> resonance effect "anomalous scattering" measured by a fluorescence 
> scan that should have all the effects mentioned by James? Don't we get 
> as a result a mixture of signals from resonance (i.e. anomalous) and 
> from absorption-emission (i.e. fluorescence) effects?
>

 Fluorescent photon emission happens well after the incident photon has 
"passed", so anomalous scattering is only indirectly related to 
fluorescence.  The relationship is that absorption induces a phase shift 
in scattering (this is the anomalous scattering effect), but it also 
induces an electronic transition in the atom, leaving a "core hole" or 
vacant orbital near the nucleus.  The filling of this core hole will 
generate a fluorescent photon (some fixed fraction of the time), and 
this allows us to equate the intensity of observed fluorescence to the 
number of core holes produced and therefore to the absorption cross 
section of the atom.  In actual fact, the "MAD scan" we do before a 
MAD/SAD experiment is not a "fluorescence spectrum", but rather an 
absorption spectrum using fluorescence as a tally.  A fluorescence 
spectrum would have the energy of the fluorescent photon on the x-axis. 
(Bob Sweet has corrected me several times for getting that wrong).

As for the connection between absorption and anomalous scattering, I 
tend to think of this in the classical picture.  Scattering lags the 
incident beam by 90 degrees because a simple harmonic oscillator driven 
at frequencies much higher than resonance lags behind the force upon 
it.  An oscillator driven at resonance will move 180 degrees 
out-of-phase with the driving force.  You can verify this yourself by 
playing with a weight tied to the end of a rubber band.  Another way to 
think about it is that absorption must create a wave that is 180 degrees 
out of phase with the incident beam because it reduces the intensity of 
the incident beam.  The details of the physics are much more complicated 
than this, but this is how I like to remember it. 

So, as you approach a resonance, some of the electrons in the atom will 
start "absorbing" (resonating) and therefore move out-of-phase with the 
other electrons in the atom (and indeed the other electrons in the 
crystal).  It is this "out of sync" behavior that reduces the effective 
occupancy of the atom and also creates an "imaginary" component to the 
scattering.  This "imaginary electron density" is hard to accept if you 
have never taken complex algebra, but the easy way to think about it is 
to remember than multiplying a complex number by sqrt(-1) changes its 
phase by 90 degrees.  So the "imaginary component" is really just a 
mathematical way to represent electrons that are out-of-sync with the 
majority of electrons in the crystal.  Yes, the majority, because a pure 
selenium crystal has no anomalous scattering (since no atoms lag any 
other atoms).  The "imaginary component" is what leads to the breakdown 
of Friedel's law (which states that the Fourier transform of a 
real-valued function is centrosymmetric).  But all this is really just a 
fancy way of saying that some of the electrons are out of phase with the 
rest.

Hope this makes sense.

-James Holton
MAD Scientist

> Best regards,
>
> Dirk.
>
> *******************************************************
> Dirk Kostrewa
> Gene Center, A 5.07
> Ludwig-Maximilians-University
> Feodor-Lynen-Str. 25
> 81377 Munich
> Germany
> Phone:     +49-89-2180-76845
> Fax:     +49-89-2180-76999
> E-mail:    [log in to unmask]
> *******************************************************

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

JiscMail Tools


RSS Feeds and Sharing


Advanced Options


Archives

April 2024
March 2024
February 2024
January 2024
December 2023
November 2023
October 2023
September 2023
August 2023
July 2023
June 2023
May 2023
April 2023
March 2023
February 2023
January 2023
December 2022
November 2022
October 2022
September 2022
August 2022
July 2022
June 2022
May 2022
April 2022
March 2022
February 2022
January 2022
December 2021
November 2021
October 2021
September 2021
August 2021
July 2021
June 2021
May 2021
April 2021
March 2021
February 2021
January 2021
December 2020
November 2020
October 2020
September 2020
August 2020
July 2020
June 2020
May 2020
April 2020
March 2020
February 2020
January 2020
December 2019
November 2019
October 2019
September 2019
August 2019
July 2019
June 2019
May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007


JiscMail is a Jisc service.

View our service policies at https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/ and Jisc's privacy policy at https://www.jisc.ac.uk/website/privacy-notice

For help and support help@jisc.ac.uk

Secured by F-Secure Anti-Virus CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager