Judy
the stars we can see with the naked eye are not cold.
M-B was consciously a Catholic, so there is always an element of
propaganda in his work, so you end with the 60s regurgitate
Maxwell-Davies( he of the ex-Fires of London) and the cult of St
Magnus.
unfortunately he was no Hopkins. I would have liked him to have been so, but ..
Ersatz music, ersatz poetry, the fantasy of the somewhere else. Gold
has no intrinsic value, a point I believe Prynne makes.
Give me Brookmyre, or Alistair Gray, or Grieve before the bus-accident
( being English I'm a great fan of Scots literature)
2008/8/26 Judy Prince <[log in to unmask]>:
> Different backgrounds and different reactions to our "same-time" lives
> probably makes for our different judgments about Brown's poem, Dave.
> For example, "Catholic" never entered my mind with the words "ingots and
> incense"----I was seeing lovely gold bars and smelling Chinese prayer
> sticks.
> As to "cold star travels across the pane", the wonder with poeticking such
> impressive AND "common" natural elements as stars, moon, sun, rain,
> clouds---is that any attempt at all can succeed. Remember Kasper's (and
> many of our) permutations on the moon moving through branches? Tricky to
> present fresh, these beloved yet common Miracle Companions. I give Brown 3
> 1/2 _stars_ for his version. <g>
>
> I earlier said "same-time lives". A couple generations away from "living on
> the land" and therefore necessarily attuned to its rhythms, we
> industrialised folk see and emphasise the Not Natural. We do it naturally;
> it's what we know. Our industrialised view, and therefore, emphasis, has
> led us away from much that brings peace, and has brought us, most
> prominently, our Self. That Self has given us a frantic, frustrated,
> unsettled culture and poetry.
>
> The fact is that the average poorest person in the world now is a
> middle-aged Asian male who works the soil. Is he frantic and unsettled and
> Self-aborbed, despite being attuned to the land? Undoubtedly!
>
> Yet so many more of us live most of the time away from essential close
> connections---to the land and to other people. How to "get" those
> connections? I'm not entirely sure.
>
> Best,
>
> Judy
>
>
>
>
>
> 2008/8/25 David Bircumshaw <[log in to unmask]>
>
>> Hi Judy
>>
>> the rag of flame, I like, and the halving school-book, But the hearth
>> turning Catholic, and the trite cold star, no, no, no.
>>
>> I don't recommend avoiding human actors, as that is what we all are.
>>
>> Christopher Grieve, in a 1950s copy of 'X' I also have, says: 'avoid
>> minor poets like the plague'
>>
>> Just read 'The Spanish Tragedy' for the first time this morning -
>> fascinatingly bad. It has a kind of tight-arsed oomph to it, the
>> English behaving badly, as it were.
>>
>> 2008/8/25 Judy Prince <[log in to unmask]>:
>> > "Outsplendours" is a tiny wart in this splendid poem, Dave.
>> > All the rest gives me a hierarchy of shivers with its direct, concise,
>> > unexpected-then-"felt" comparisons ("moth......troubles the rag of
>> flame",
>> > "school-book.....two yellow halves", "The hearth ingots and incense", "A
>> > cold star travels across the pane").
>> >
>> > Objects do all the work, even summoning the "scythe-men"---a compound
>> word
>> > as if a compounded creature---that helps regenerate, prepares the soil.
>> The
>> > lamp, personal and universal, apprentices each season. [One is reminded
>> of
>> > Sharon Brogan's beautiful "Moon" series.]
>> >
>> > Brown carefully avoids human "act-ers": "....is match struck to wick".
>> The
>> > passive voice; the phrase's subject is not a person.
>> >
>> > One would be hard-pressed to succeed so grandly in such a little space.
>> >
>> > Best,
>> >
>> > Judy
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > 2008/8/25 David Bircumshaw <[log in to unmask]>
>> >
>> >> Yes and no. I always thought of him as a poet I would like to like:
>> >> when he was alive I would look at each book hoping that this time ...
>> >> some of the Ikey Faa stuff he did, yes, some of the collisions of
>> >> primitive statement, yes, but ... the poem Jon has quoted, it's ok,
>> >> but behind lurks the spectre of stock association.
>> >>
>> >> I thought the second stanza best. 'outsplendours' oh dear, no. He
>> >> falls for Parnassian a lot (vide Hopkins on Tennyson for that term)
>> >>
>> >> If I compare Mackay Brown to Garioch then the latter gets my vote.
>> >>
>> >> One has to be very ginger in handling the notion of vanished worlds.
>> >> One might end up in Akenfield.
>> >>
>> >> Best
>> >>
>> >> Dave
>> >>
>> >> 2008/8/25 Judy Prince <[log in to unmask]>:
>> >> > Yes, it is damned good.
>> >> >
>> >> > 2008/8/25 Jon Corelis <[log in to unmask]>
>> >> >
>> >> >> Saw from a notice in the London Review of Books that The Collected
>> >> >> Poems of George Mackay Brown is available in paperback (John Murray
>> >> >> 2006). which I hadn't known about. I've admired his poetry in the
>> >> >> past, so will have look at this. The notice in the LRB quotes a
>> >> >> little:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> ---------
>> >> >> The lamp is needful in spring, still,
>> >> >> Though the jar of daffodils
>> >> >> Outsplendours lamplight and hearthflames.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> In summer only near midnight
>> >> >> Is match struck to wick.
>> >> >> A moth, maybe, troubles the rag of flame.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Harvest. The lamp in the window
>> >> >> Summons the scythe-men.
>> >> >> A school-book lies on the sill, two yellow halves.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> In December the lamp's a jewel,
>> >> >> The hearth ingots and incense.
>> >> >> A cold star travels across the pane.
>> >> >> ---------
>> >> >>
>> >> >> That is damned good. I suppose though that world is gone now.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> --
>> >> >> ===============================================
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Jon Corelis http://jcorelis.googlepages.com/joncorelis
>> >> >>
>> >> >> ===============================================
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> David Bircumshaw
>> >> Website and A Chide's Alphabet
>> >> http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.bircumshaw/
>> >> The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
>> >> Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
>> >>
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> David Bircumshaw
>> Website and A Chide's Alphabet
>> http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.bircumshaw/
>> The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
>> Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
>>
>
--
David Bircumshaw
Website and A Chide's Alphabet http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.bircumshaw/
The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
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