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SIDNEY-SPENSER  June 2007

SIDNEY-SPENSER June 2007

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Subject:

correction

From:

"James C. Nohrnberg" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Sidney-Spenser Discussion List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 21 Jun 2007 14:17:57 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

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text/plain (313 lines)

That should be "intriguing ... Fasciculus Morum."  -- jcn

On Thu, 21 Jun 2007 14:11:01 -0400
  "James C. Nohrnberg" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> All of this (on the grene path to lyfe":  in E.K. on "November") is very 
>intirguing, and perhaps conventionally so, in the light of the Fasculus 
>Morum,  V.xiii, on two ways, this being the kind of text (a preacher's 
>handbook, here discoursing on Accedia) that Chaucer's Parson might have 
>been using himself:
> 
> And notice that although both are evil: to sin, and after confession to
> slide back, yet the latter is worse, according to the words of Peter 2: 
>"For
> it is better not to know the way of justice than after knowing it to
> turn back."  And thus it is said in Ecclesiasticus 2:  "Woe to the sinner
> who goes on the earth two ways."  For two ways are put before man, one 
>that
> leads to life--that is the one man takes when he clings to God by his good
> deeds, of which is written:  "This is the way, walk in it"--; the other 
>that
> leads to death, of which [it] is said in Proverbs 24:  "There is a way 
>that
> seems good to a man; but its ends lead to death."  This way one takes when
> one withdraws from God and clings to the devil by sin. ...  [There follows
> an anecdote of a dog who who heard two horns calling him to dinner in two
> different directions -- i.e., a good life leading to heaven vs. fleshly
> delight leading to hedonistic satisfactions -- and got no meal at all,
> because of his vacillation]   And thus, throughout the whole day, that is,
> this life, they [the vacillating] follow a double path and will find no 
>rest
> in a good life, as is said in Ecclesiasticus 3: "A heart that goes two 
>ways
> shall have no rest."  So, when the night of death comes, they will fail to
> reach either banquet, for when the soul leaves the body, they go down to
> hell, deprived of the joy of heaven and pulled away from the delights of 
>the
> flesh.  Therefore it is the way of wisdom that, once one has come out of 
>the
> state of sin, one does not return to it but rather remains firmly in the
> state of grace; hence the words of Ecclesiasticus 5:  "Be steadfast in the
> way of the Lord and in the truth of your judgment.  (Wenzel tr. 485)
> 
> There is also the path as that of bewilderment or as misleading, as in 
>Machaut, Remede de Fortune, ed./tr. Wimsatt and Kibler, where the lover is 
>self-led into a comforting but alien and secluded and solitary garden of 
>delights, in a passage resembling the one from Romance of the Rose cited by 
>Kathryn Walls:
> 
> Thus I left my dear lady and went away miserable ... eager to reach some
> hidden place where I could cease my weeping and regain my composure. ... I
> went along thus for a while, ever lost in my thoughts, until I saw a very
> beautiful garden called the Park of Hesdin (Hedon -- as in hedonism). 
> Then
> I headed straight for it and didn't stop until I'd come there; but I
> couldn't enter because it was surrounded and enclosed by high walls, and 
>the
> road was not open to one and all.  Nonetheless I followed the paths and
> trails I saw before me until I reached a closed gate, which was beautiful
> and nobly situated in a remote spot, far from people.  I raised the latch 
>of
> small wicket; and after I'd lifted it, I went in.  But I saw no one 
>within,
> which made me happier, because I wanted to be alone if possible.  And when
> I'd succeeded in entering and found myself all alone, I bolted the lock on
> the wicket.  I walked along among the plantings, which were more beautiful
> than any I'd ever seen, nor will I ever see any so beautiful, so fair, so
> agreeable, so pleasing, or so delightful.  I could never describe the
> marvels ... I can well say that one could not seek any diversion in the 
>air,
> in water, or on land that he'd not find there imediately, always read to
> answer his wish. ... I wandered up hills and down until I came upon a 
>valley
> in which I saw a fountain that was perfeclty clear and beautiful, 
>surrounded
> by trees and grass; and around it had sprung up a little hedge of wild
> roses.  But I saw no beaten or well-trod path or trail, only the thick,
> sharp-bladed grass.  I surmised that few people came there, so I set off 
>in
> that direction.  I passed through the little hedge and came to the clear,
> limpid fountain, where I washed my face and eyes; aferwards I sat down,
> because the place I'd thus reached seemed very secluded.  ¶ Then I grew
> deeply despondent, blaming myself for having left my lady as I did. 
>(Remedy, 771-840)
> 
> We learn from this, then, that a path may be described as green because it 
>is little
> trodden, as opposed to its being green mainly because it is inviting -- or 
>seductive.
> 
> In the Cursor Mundi Seth is commissioned by his dying father Adam to go to
> paradise to fetch him the medicinal oil of mercy:
> 
> To Seth his son thus he said:
> "Son, he said, thou must go
> To paradise from which I came,
> To cherubim at the gate
> Who keep the way to it."
> Seth said to his father then,
> "How stands it father, and where?"
> "I shall tell you," he said, "saying
> How you shall take the right way --
> Toward the east end of the vale yonder:
> A green way you shall find --
> In that way you shall find and see
> The steps of thy mother and me.
>For follow in that green grass
> That ever since has been seen
> Where we came -- going inadvisedly,
> When we were put out of paradise --
> Into this same wretched vale [=slade]
> There where myself first was made:
>For the grossness of our sin.
> No grass may grow since therein --
> That same will lead you on the way [=gate],
> From hence to paradise's gate [=3ate].
>       (Morris ed. I:81, ll. 1242ff, after Trinity ms. [doubtfully 
> rendered])
> 
> -- This route would seem to be a kind of putative original for a green 
>pathway to life.
> 
> Pathway is word combining two possible different meanings -- a path 
>through
> a forest is generally narrow and singular, a footpath, a thing to be
> scrutinzed critically, whereas the way west takes in a quarter of the
> compass and is thronged by wagon wheels, the ways of God to man are many,
> and all of India is found upon the Grand Trunk Road.  See Gregory, Morals 
>on
> Job:  "For a 'path' is usually narrower than a 'way;''  but by 'ways' we
> understand actions, so by 'paths' we not unjustly understand the mere
> thoughts of them.  "So God 'looketh narrowly into all our paths, ' in that
> in all our several actions He takes account of the thoughts of the heart
> too; and He 'marketh the prints of our feet,'  ... And very commonly, when
> we do some things wrong, whereas our brethren see it, we are setting them 
>a
> bad example, and our foot being as it were turned out of the way, we leave
> to those that follow our footesteps all awry, while by our own deeds we 
>lead
> the way for other men's conscience to stumble."  (XI.xlvii, 63)  Gregory
> contrasts "the broad way of the present life" with "the narrow paths of
> heavenly precept" -- for "who can be ignorant that a path is narrower than 
>a
> way?" (XXXI.xxiv, 43).
> 
> E.K.'s passage has inspired Milton not only in the sonnet's "Wisely hast 
>shun'd the broad way and the green" (which seems to be a version of "the 
>flowery way that leads to the broad gate and the [devil's] great fire" in 
>All's Well, IV.v.53f. after Matt. 7:13), which John Leonard cites, but also 
>inspired the poet in regard to stating the subject of PL (a poem which ends 
>with the word "way"):
> 
> Compare:
> 'For though the trespasse of the first man brought death into the world, 
>as the guerdon of sinne, yet being ouercome by the death of one, that dyed 
>for al, it is now made (as Chaucer sayth) the grene path way to lyfe'.
> 
> ...Mans First Disobedience ...
> ...that Forbidden Tree, whose mortal taste
> Brought Death into the World,
> ... till one greater Man
> Restore us, and regain the blissful Seat
> 
> The path in Job 8:12-13, 16 is cited by Shawcross on the sonnet, as 
>"Whilst it is yet in his greeness, and not cut down, it withereth before 
>any other herb.  So are the paths of all that forget God; and the 
>hypocrite's hope shall perish:  ... He is green before the sun..."   And 
>this does indeed sound rather like the green pathway to hell, Leonard 
>citing my teachers Bush and Woodhouse citing Smart on Ascham misciting 
>Chaucer (= Ascham, Toxophilus, English Works, ed. W. A. Wright, Cambridge, 
>1904, 23:  "Chauser doth saye verie well in the Parsons tale, the greene 
>path waye to hel.").  -- Jim N.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And  On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:13:28 +1200
>  Kathryn Walls <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> If spiritually negative pathways are relevant, cf. the path within the
>> Garden of Love RR 729ff. "Tho wente I forth on my right hond/Doun by a
>> lytel path I fond/Of mentes full, and fenell grene/And faste by, without
>> wene,/Sir Myrthe I fond".  But there must be many such paths, I realize.
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>>From: Sidney-Spenser Discussion List
>> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John Leonard
>> Sent: Thursday, 14 June 2007 11:35 p.m.
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: The grene path way to lyfe
>> 
>> Dear Bert,
>> 
>> The line you quote immediately made me think of "the broad way and the 
>> green" In Milton's Sonnet IX, so I checked the Milton Variorum and found
>> a 
>> goldmine of information, including this, from Ascham, Toxophilus,
>> English 
>> Works, ed. W. A. Wright, Cambridge, 1904, 23:  "Chauser doth saye verie
>> well 
>> in the Parsons tale, the greene path waye to hel."  Woodhouse and Bush
>> add: 
>> "The phrase is not in the Parson's Tale and Ascham's memory was at
>> fault, as 
>> Smart observes."
>> 
>> So, I find myself wondering whether E.K. has picked this up from Ascham,
>> and 
>> that what we have here is one scholar's bad memory infecting another's
>> (a 
>> common occurrence, even today).  E.K. changes the significance of the
>> path 
>> (it leads to virtue), but that might be either a further memory lapse or
>> a 
>> deliberate inversion of Matt. 7.13 (the broad way) and Job 8.12-13 (the 
>> 'greenness' of the 'the paths of all that forget God').  One last
>> thought: 
>> Puritans often thought that Chaucer had written Piers Plowman.  I wonder
>> if 
>> Langland might produce a missing piece of the puzzle?
>> 
>> Best,
>> 
>> John Leonard
>> 
>> 
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>From: "A.C. Hamilton" <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>> Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2007 7:20 PM
>> Subject: The grene path way to lyfe
>> 
>> 
>>>A time when the whole world seems ready to mount a green bandwagon - in
>> 
>>>Canada there is even a Federal Green Party - seems an appropriate time
>> to 
>>>raise a matter that has bothered me for many years, in fact, from the
>> time 
>>>I wrote an article on The Shepheardes Calender over fifty years ago. It
>> 
>>>concerns E. K.'s gloss on the November emblem: 'For though the
>> trespasse of 
>>>the first man brought death into the world, as the guerdon of sinne,
>> yet 
>>>being ouercome by the death of one, that dyed for al, it is now made
>> (as 
>>>Chaucer sayth) the grene path way to lyfe'.
>>>
>>> Evidently Chaucer did not say this though only a major poet would be 
>>> capable of such a powerful statement, even more powerful, surely, than
>> 
>>> Marvell's 'green Thought in a green shade'. I recall making my way 
>>> unsuccessfully through Thynne in the hope that the line was from a
>> poem 
>>> attributed to Chaucer. In 1982 I used E. K.'s phrase as the title of
>> an 
>>> essay on Spenser's poem in the hope that I would be shamed into
>> finding 
>>> its source. I didn't and I am.
>>>
>>> I can't recall that any comment on E. K.'s gloss in later 
>>> twentieth-century editions of the poem, and, surprisingly, not even in
>> the 
>>> Variorum Spenser. Of recent editions, the Yale Shorter Poems, has no 
>>> comment at all. In a recent edition of the poem, Douglas Brooks-Davies
>> 
>>> writes: 'E. K. paraphrases the opening of the Parson's Tale (itself 
>>> translated from Jeremiah 6:16: "seeth . . . which is the good way, and
>> 
>>> walketh in that way, and ye shall find refreshing for your souls".'
>> That 
>>> tale begins by citing Jeremiah: 'Stondeth upon the weyes, and seeth
>> and 
>>> axeth of olde pathes (that is to seyn, of olde sentences) which is the
>> 
>>> good wey, / and walketh in that wey'. In his edition, Richard McCabe 
>>> glosses: 'cf. the opening sentences of The Parson's tale quoting
>> Jeremiah 
>>> 6:16'. Robinson's edition of Chaucer notes that Chaucer cites the
>> Vulgate; 
>>> and the Geneva Bible, which E. K. would certainly know, urges that we 
>>> 'aske for the olde waie, which is the good way & walke therein, and
>> yet 
>>> shal finde rest for your soules'. No hint here that death is 'the
>> grene 
>>> path way to lyfe', though in the November eclogue, death for Dido is
>> the 
>>> green pathway to life, for once resurrected, she is seen walking in 
>>> 'fieldes ay fresh, the grasse ay greene', which is redolent of the
>> 'green 
>>> pasture' promised by the Psalmist.
>>>
>>> Is E. K.'s gloss simply unglossable, apart from idle speculation that 
>>> Spenser as 'our new poet' demonstrated that he has replaced 'that good
>> old 
>>> poet', Chaucer, by attributing to him a line that he wrote himself? 
>>> Bert
>>> 
> 
> [log in to unmask]
> James Nohrnberg
> Dept. of English, Bryan Hall 219
> Univ. of Virginia
> P.O Box 400121
> Charlottesville, VA 22904-4121

[log in to unmask]
James Nohrnberg
Dept. of English, Bryan Hall 219
Univ. of Virginia
P.O Box 400121
Charlottesville, VA 22904-4121

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