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MEDIEVAL-RELIGION  May 2006

MEDIEVAL-RELIGION May 2006

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Subject:

Re: Indecipherable Symbols

From:

Terrill Heaps <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

medieval-religion - Scholarly discussions of medieval religious culture <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 24 May 2006 04:55:51 -0800

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (147 lines)

medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture

Yes, Susan's posting is filled with indecipherable symbols. This is because the
encoding she typed it in was Unicode (UTF), instead of the standard Latin
Western (ISO-8859-1).

Her posting is copied below. If you will now change your encoding to Unicode,
the gibberish will disappear. After you are through reading it, you can change
your encoding back to Latin Western (ISO-8859-1). In fact, be sure that you do
change yours back, so that your own future postings won't be filled with
gibberish.

(Example: It's very unusual = Itâ*™s very unusual)

Terrill
--------------
Marjorie Greene wrote:

> Is it my computer or is this message full of indecipherable symbols?
> MG
>
> >
> >medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture
> >
> >In a message dated 22/05/2006 23:27:30 GMT Daylight Time,
> >[log in to unmask] writes:
> ><<Further thoughts, kids abed, should be  doing something elseâ*| >>
> >
> >Like the Rabbi said, life begins when the children leave home and the  dog
> >is
> >dead...
> >
> ><<Itâ*™s very unusual for resident chaplains to be  called
> â*˜canonsâ*™: in
> >fact Iâ*™
> >ve never come across it. Are you sure the  prebendaries (i.e. the receivers
> >of prebends) were not the canons, which is  entirely normal, and the
> >resident
> >chaplains not effectively their vicars?  >>
> >
> >These were exactly my expectations.  See my reply to your  first.  Here's
> >the
> >transcription of what the Chantry Commissioners said  (Lawrence Snell, /The
> >Chantry Certificates for Cornwall /(Documents towards a  history of the
> >Reformation in Cornwall, No 1) (Exeter, nd [1953?])):
> >
> >[Chantry Certificate 15/89]:  â*œâ*| The Deanery or Rectorye there
> >ffounded by
> >kyng Adelstone to ffynde a Dean or a parson who is charged wythe  three
> >curattes to serve in three sevâ*™all churches that is to say one to
> >mynystre  in the
> >churche of saynt Buryan wâ*™ is the mother churche & the other towe to
> >celebrate
> >in towe chappelles scituate wtin the paroche of saynt Buryan And being
> >distant from the paryshe churche three evâ*™ye one of them three myles
> >thereaboutes.
> >  To ffynde also three pâ*™bendaryes to helpe to celebrate  dyvyne
> servyce
> >wythin the paryshe churche of saynt Buryan aforesayde wâ*™ Dean  & other
> >the sayd pâ*™
> >bendaryes have for the mayntenance of their lyvings the  revenues of
> >certayne
> >landes appoynted out for ye purpose dyvyded amongst theâ*™  equallye
> >accordyng
> >to theyr severall porcons.â**
> >
> >[Certificate 9/4:  â*œâ*| ffounded wtin the pâ*™ishe Churche of
> Beryan  to
> >the
> >Dean or Rector / of Beryan whyche hath the cure of ye pâ*™ishe churche of
>
> >beryan &
> >of ij other pâ*™ishe Churches being chappelles therunto appendaunt  And
> ys
> >charged wythe thre pâ*™ishe churches.â**
> >
> >The first certificate has  three parishes and the second just one--which
> >reflects the odd status of  those parishes.
> >
> ><<It would be interesting to know if these chaplains had any  parochial
> >responsibilities (eg at St Levan): a dual responsibility for both  parish
> >and
> >liturgy in the church itself crops up at some other former minster
> >collegiate
> >churches.  >>
> >
> >They did, as far as I can see, at  least at times.  When things were very
> >prosperous, it looks as though there  were chaplains appointed to do the
> >duties
> >at Buryan for the prebendaries, in  addition to the King's Clerk who said
> >masses for AEthelstan, but at other times  (probably most of the time,
> >given the
> >complaints of neglect), the same men did  both parish duties and minster
> >duties,
> >if they did them at all.
> >
> ><<Likewise to know more about the lands that made up these  prebends: for
> >example, was St Levan on any particular prebendâ*™s land? If so,  would
> >â*˜hisâ*™
> >chaplain (if the chaplains are indeed vicars for the prebends) have  played
> >a
> >specific role there?>>
> >
> >We'd all like to know about the land.  Nicholas Orme, inter alios,  has
> >studied it, and cannot say for sure.  The lands which supported the
> >Deanery until
> >1548 (and which were afterwards known as the Manor of Buryan and  alienated
> >from the church) were almost certainly those described in Domesday,  which
> >in
> >turn seem to be the same as those in the AEthelstan charter
> >(unsurprisingly,
> >whether or not the charter is a forgery).  The problem is  that although
> >some of
> >them are still readily identifiable, quite a lot of it  could be anywhere
> >in
> >the Deanery.  Anglo-Saxon transliteration of early  mediaeval Cornish can
> >be
> >pretty impenetrable--not that I know either language,  but that's what
> >those
> >who do say, and I believe them...
> >
> >But the consensus  is that most of the land was within what is now Buryan
> >(the identifiable places  all are), and that although one of the
> >prebendaries was
> >'of Trethyn', which  seems to be Treen in St Levan, it isn't certain that
> >any
> >of his lands were  there.  I suspect they were, however.  There were some
> >odd
> >(for this  area) land-ownership patterns in Treen in 1838 which may hark
> >back
> >to  this.  Again it needs a lot more work.
> >
> >Susan
> >[log in to unmask]

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