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MEDIEVAL-RELIGION  April 2005

MEDIEVAL-RELIGION April 2005

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Subject:

Re: Rocamadour

From:

Christopher Crockett <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

medieval-religion - Scholarly discussions of medieval religious culture <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sat, 23 Apr 2005 11:35:09 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

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text/plain (107 lines)

medieval-religion: Scholarly discussions of medieval religion and culture

From: Marjorie Greene <[log in to unmask]>

> Problem is when I go to
 http://www.pilgrimsall.org/placesofpilgrimage/Pilgrimages/Roc/Photos3.htm

> I see at least three different statues of BVM. I think... Is there an
"official" N D de R"?

you've gotten the wrong URL somehow, MG.

the one i sent is :

http://www.pilgrimsall.org/placesofpilgrimage/r/Roc07.html

the V&C i was thinking of as being late 12th c. is the big one in the middle.

but now, here comes Jim, to rain on my parade:

From: Jim Bugslag <[log in to unmask]>

>> http://www.pilgrimsall.org/placesofpilgrimage/r/Roc07.html

>I don't think the main image here is Notre-Dame de Rocamadour.

Alls i knows is what i read on the web, Jim.

i find it hard to believe that a webpage could contain any false or misleading
information.

plus the author of this site has cunningly disabled the "right click" feature
which allows one to see directly the URL of the .jpg --i had to do an equally
cunning "View Source" in order to find it.

the V&C at the top of the page is this one:

http://www.pilgrimsall.org/placesofpilgrimage/r/Roc07.jpg

it is that one which i'm happy putting a late 12th c. date to, whether it is
from Rocamadour or not.

plus, it has the added attraction of being a "Vierge noir".

i'm sure that it would be in Forsyth's catalogue of Madonnas, but i don't have
that at hand at present.

>One of the smaller images on the right-hand side does show it, however.

presumably this one

http://www.pilgrimsall.org/placesofpilgrimage/Pilgrimages/Roc/Pil/Pil082.htm

http://www.pilgrimsall.org/placesofpilgrimage/Pilgrimages/Roc/Pil/Pil083.htm

i note from another page

http://www.pilgrimsall.org/placesofpilgrimage/Roc.htm

that it is "Covered with blackened sheets of silver, this is the 12th century
reliquary statue of Notre-Dame de Rocamadour."

there you go --yet another way to account for a "Black" Virgin.

assuming that we can rely upon the accuracy of the information given on that
site.

curious that the silver would ever be allowed to tarnish into blackness.

normally the whole point of covering a wood statue with silver (or gold) would
be to have it shine, i would suspect, and frequent polishing could easily be
integrated into the various liturgical activities associated with a major
feast day, when the statue would be an object of much massaging anyway.

at Chartres the gold and jewel-encrusted Holy Box was annually "washed down"
with wine and water (i don't know on which feast day) and, in the mid 13th c.
the canons went through some considerable litigation to take away the
customary rights of a local family to perform this act, in part because they
claimed the right to keep any jewels which fell off during the process.

Robert Branner publishes in his book of Chartres sources one of the several
charters which this litigation produced.

c



"What about the older ones [Indians] ?"

"Well, we can't seem to cure them of the idea that our Everyday Life is only
an Illusion, behind which is the Reality of Dreams"

--Werner Herzog's "Fitzcarraldo"
http://us.imdb.com/Title?0083946

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