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Subject:

Re: Snap

From:

Lawrence Upton <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Poetryetc provides a venue for a dialogue relating to poetry and poetics <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 13 Oct 2005 08:59:48 +0100

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (142 lines)

Dear Judy,

I don't *think that I do that kind of teasing.

It was a straight question.

I didn't mean you to write so much; so thank you for taking the trouble.

I was and am aware of the things you tell me, but they were not consciously in my mind when I wrote. Actually, I don't think that USA was there at all.

It happens now and then.

I had seen WALLACE AND GROMIT AND THE WERE RABBIT, title subject to correction

I am quite happy for you to read it as you have, I think; you've given me some confidence that the poem may have some merit. But not everything there fits the realistic account of animated films - *I was thinking of animation inclusively, fairly clued in I believe on how it's done - rather than just Disney et al. I wasn't even thinking of Disney as such or Disney as a symbol of USA. Just the mutability of a narrative in editing an animation The problem is greater, the USA being perhaps a very large, perhaps the biggest, example.

But I was thinking of individuals, daily exercising what they claim to need, their choice

Yet I can say little about it. Something about a response to phone calls in which everything made sense and yet I kept wondering what people were talking about; in which everything seemed straight-forward and yet I felt misled. A confluence of people rewriting rewritten personal and other histories shared in friendships and acquaintanceships... Rewiriting not to get it right but to make it fit a new set of approved knowledge

LIstening to some political broadcasts maybe, especially the shenanigans over Turkey-in-Europe, maybe India and Pakistan, with individuals finding that the sight of their enemies suffering brings some of them to tears; and the politicians talking over it, seeing an opportunity in the midst of many they cannot see

That, anyway, regarding backgrounds

I heard, in a one time friend's voice, recalled, mistrusted, the words of the poem; and I sensed that I had come in on activity, posed activity, such as one gets in a party political broadcast here where "the mother" or "the nurse" speaks... They usually reek of artificiality because the writers have no good idea of those people, or not in the appropriate social setting

Here the person speaking to me was making *themselves artificial by a mode deceiving, including self-deception

I didn't know what it meant. I heard it as if I had just arrived unseen and they became aware of me

I "heard" it quite late at night on Tuesday. I was listening to a band called Polar Bear, two sax, drums, bass. The drummer is very good, but he hasn't learned to speak yet; and he does all the speaking, as the leader of the band - sometimes the others in the band turn his mike off if he gets too bad, to get him back behind the drums, though that's partly part of the entertainment

And while he was talking about the starting point of a piece, the poem occurred to me

I didn't get any specific meaning from it at any level. Came home and went to bed. But during the following day it occurred to me it was a posttcard delivered early. I made a few small changes, and hesitated. And sent it very near the end of the day, thinking Why not?

all best


L 
  -----Original Message-----
  From: judy prince <[log in to unmask]>
  To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
  Date: Thursday, October 13, 2005 2:02 AM
  Subject: Re: Snap


  Lawrence, you're not "having me on," as they say in England, which (I think) 
  means teasing, are you?

  Now to what you ask.  My country's THE world's fantasy capitol.  My son 
  currently lives in the place that Disney built (Los Angeles), and we 
  Americans have grown up on animated cartoons and films.  They were the most 
  potent versions of fairy tales we had in our childhoods (why, after all, 
  with such engaging films, did we need books?).  Mention Brothers Grimm, and 
  we will give you a blank look.  Mention Mickey and Minnie Mouse, Donald Duck 
  and Pluto, and we "get" where you're coming from.

  I interpreted your symbols in the light of my country's current elected 
  federal officials, your words "animators," "background," "redrawn," and 
  "team," to mean animated cartoons.

  If I'm reading America's current leadership accurately, their 
  grip---spiritually, intellectually, emotionally, and physically---on the 
  wheel of the Ship of State is as stable and profound as Goofy.

  "When you wish upon a star, makes no difference who you are," the Disney 
  program logo sings.  It's a beautiful wish for democracy, the Great 
  Levelling.

  If we don't work hard to position and elect Moral Stars to help us govern 
  ourselves and guide us, we will surely get the elected cartoon characters 
  that we deserve.

  Your characteristically spare writing became even leaner in this poem, and I 
  think to good effect---a punch to our senses and minds, repeat punches, in 
  fact---comparable to the innumerable punches in an animated cartoon.  It is 
  said that all of those cartoon punches witnessed by children do affect their 
  sensitivities in the same way that martial video games do.  They 
  de-humanize.  Fighting seems so . . . entertaining.  How much more, then, 
  have our leaders' punching and punchy decisions de-sensitized us?

  Thanks for your giving us the framework from which to draw these and many 
  more comparisons.

  Happy you?

  Good.

  'night, Lawrence.

  Judy the Shmoo

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: "Lawrence Upton" <[log in to unmask]>
  To: <[log in to unmask]>
  Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 7:43 PM
  Subject: Re: Snap


  Hallo Judy

  I like to think that I am profound and entertaining. Effectiveness is icing.

  As to intention, please tell me what comparison *you think I have drawn.

  I'll be sleeping soon, but look forward to your answer in a few hours.

  All best

  Lawrence

    -----Original Message-----
    From: judy prince <[log in to unmask]>
    To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
    Date: Thursday, October 13, 2005 12:13 AM
    Subject: Re: Snap


    Lawrence,

    This is a hoot---a most effective comparison drawn!  Whether you intended 
  it
    or not, it was quite entertaining (and, yes, profound, of course, too).

    Judy

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: "Lawrence Upton" <[log in to unmask]>
    To: <[log in to unmask]>
    Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 6:46 PM
    Subject: Snap


    There are many problems.
    It has taken many animators.
    The backgrounds are redrawn every day.
    Historians rewrite the dialogue.
    Diplomats reinvigorate intentions.
    Morality is impossible. This is a team.
    And we all need a holiday

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