> ----------
> From: Graham Findlay[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 10:02
> To: Mary Gwynne (E-mail)
> Subject: FW: buses angles and slopes
>
> Hi Mary - re your accessibuilt message. Feel free to distribute to list
> members
>
> Graham
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Graham Findlay
> Sent: 05 April 2004 10:01
> To: 'Accessibuilt list'
> Subject: RE: buses angles and slopes
>
>
> See extract below from the MUNI website
> (http://www.sfmuni.com/rid/rptpub/documents/mag2003.htm#_Toc38090685) the
> public transport system for San Francisco. These buses have been in
> service since early 1980, and every bus in the fleet is now accessible -
> so some bits of the Earth seem to have made more substantial progress than
> others! Similar facilities in New York I believe.
>
> "Lifts and Securements
>
> Accessible buses are equipped with mechanical lifts at the front door that
> provide level boarding of the bus from the street or sidewalk for
> customers with mobility impairments. Lifts are for anyone with a
> disability who is unable to use the steps to board the bus, including
> persons using wheelchairs, walkers, crutches, or other mobility aids, and
> those with less visible disabilities such as arthritis, heart ailments or
> breathing impairments. Inform the bus operator if you need to use the
> lift.
>
> Please note that lifts are not intended for non-disabled customers with
> baby strollers, package carts, etc. Lift platforms on most buses are at
> least 4 feet long and 3 feet wide. They are solid and sturdy, with
> handrails on both sides. There is adequate turning room inside the bus to
> accommodate most standard manual and power wheelchairs, including
> three-wheeled models. Newer accessible buses have two securement areas
> near the front of the vehicle. Older buses have one securement area.
>
> If two wheelchair users are traveling together, contact the Accessible
> Services Program for the latest information on lines served by buses with
> two securement areas.
>
> Boarding Using a Lift
>
> Make sure you are visible to the driver as the bus approaches.
> When the bus is in position, stay back from the curb about four feet to
> allow enough room for the lift to be lowered. When you are ready, the
> operator will lower the lift.
> Ambulatory customers using the lift should stand on the platform facing
> the inside of the bus, hold on to the handrails and duck their heads when
> approaching the doorway.
> Most wheelchair users prefer to board facing backwards, but may board
> facing either direction. Wheelchair users should roll squarely onto the
> platform and lock their wheels during boarding and alighting.
> When boarding be sure to tell the driver where you would like to get off. > Wheelchairs users should roll down the aisle to the securement area,
> making sure that passengers seated in front of the bus have moved their
> feet out of the way.
>
>
> Getting to the Securement Area
>
> Let the operator know if you need help using the securements. The
> securement areas are created by lifting up either the first row of front
> facing and the adjacent row of side-facing seats or the second set of side
> facing seats at the front of the bus. Pull the lever beneath the seats to
> raise them and expose the securement area. Inform the operator if you need
> help lifting the seat.
> Back the wheelchair into the open wheel clamp to secure the chair. The
> wheel clamp fits most manual and power chairs, but does not accommodate
> three-wheelers or other chairs with small back wheels.
>
>
> While the new Muni buses have two securement areas, the older vehicles
> have only one.
> Using the lift to disembark
>
> About a block before your stop, pull the "stop request" cord or push the
> stop request strip or button located along side the securement position. > After the bus has stopped, release the securements by pushing down the
> wheel clamp lever to release your wheel, and undoing the safety belts.
> Since it is not always clear if help is wanted, let the operator know if
> you need help releasing the securements.
> Leave the bus after other passengers have gotten off. Roll squarely onto
> the raised lift platform and lock your wheels. When the lift platform has
> lowered and the safety barrier has dropped, roll carefully off the
> platform.
> Note: There are some stops that are not recommended for lift use because
> the grade is too steep, there are no curb cuts, or the sidewalk is too
> narrow. These stops are clearly marked with a symbol painted in yellow on
> the street. "
>
> Graham Findlay
> Access Officer
> Disability Wales
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gwynne, Mary [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: 05 April 2004 08:26
> To: Graham Findlay
> Subject: Re: buses angles and slopes
>
>
> I am surprised and disappointed that in a world that people can design
> rockets to go to the moon, that someone can't design a bus than can be
> used
> by everyone in Rural or Urban areas on earth.
> Regards
> Mary Gwynne
> Policy Development Officer(Access)
> * : <<...OLE_Obj...>> 01792 636733 (voice and text)
> * : [log in to unmask]
> * : Performance and Strategic Planning,
> Chief Executive's Department.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > ----------
> > From: Vin[SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> > Reply To: Accessibuilt list
> > Sent: Saturday, April 03, 2004 11:49
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: Re: buses angles and slopes
> >
> > I am afraid I find this a most appalling cop-out!
> >
> > We are not talking about trying to make old vehicles accessible but the
> > design of new vehicles and I think wheelchair users have waited quite
> long
> > enough for the bus! Equal access to something as basic as public
> transport
> > is a human right and should not be at the whim of vehicle manufacturers.
> >
> > These vehicles once in service will not be replaced for many years and
> > even
> > though those in cities will have shorter lives they will then be used
> for
> > another few years in rural areas; extending the time that disabled
> people
> > have to wait!
> >
> > I find these figures completely unacceptable.
> >
> > Vin West
> > Secretary, Arfon Access Group
> > Glyn Dwr
> > Llandwrog Uchaf
> > Caernarfon
> > Gwynedd
> > LL54 7RA
> > Tel: 01286880761
> > Mob:
> > Fax: 0017756652884
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Peter Monk" <[log in to unmask]>
> > To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 2:30 PM
> > Subject: Re: buses angles and slopes
> >
> >
> > Mary the specs were very closely considered by organisations such as
> > DIPTAC,
> > Access Association and JMU. Accessible kneeling buses are designed to
> > work
> > with ordinary kerbs and the lowest possible height a bus can "kneel"
> down
> > to. The arithmetic does not allow normal gradient guidelines to be
> > achieved
> > except where boarder kerbs can be put in.
> >
> > Peter Monk
> > Access Officer
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Gwynne, Mary [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> > Sent: 01 April 2004 11:35
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: FW: buses angles and slopes
> >
> >
> > I have been looking at the bus regulations and could not believe that
> the
> > angles they are referring to for ramps are so steep.
> > (c) with the vehicle on a flat surface, in the normal condition
> > for
> > a wheelchair user to board or alight, and with the boarding ramp
> extended
> > and sitting on a kerb of 125mm in height measured vertically from and
> > parallel to the ground, the surface of a boarding ramp shall have a
> slope
> > measured over the surface referred to in sub-paragraph (3)(a) of not
> more
> > than 7° ( amended to 8) measured relative to the ground;
> >
> > > (d) notwithstanding (c) above, a boarding ramp may have -
> > >
> > > (i) at the intersection of the surface of the kerb and
> the
> > > surface of the ramp described above, a slope not exceeding 15°
> relative
> > to
> > > the ground over a distance of not more than 150mm (measured along the
> > > surface of the ramp and parallel to the direction of travel of a
> > reference
> > > wheelchair when it is moved from the kerb and onto the ramp surface),
> > and
> > >
> > > (ii) at any other point a slope not exceeding 15°
> relative
> > > to the ground over a distance of not more than 150mm (measured along
> the
> > > surface of the ramp and parallel to the direction of travel of a
> > reference
> > > wheelchair when it is moved into the vehicle) and rising to a height
> of
> > > not more than 15mm (measured above and parallel to the surface of the
> > ramp
> > > or its sections);
> > >
> > > (e) with the vehicle on a flat surface and in the normal
> condition
> > > for a wheelchair user to board or alight, the boarding ramp shall be
> > > capable of being extended to and of sitting on that surface and in
> this
> > > position the surface of a boarding ramp shall have a slope of not more
> > > than 20° measured over the surface referred to in sub-paragraph
> (3)(a);
> > >
> > >
> > It means that the ramp on a pavement of 125mm at 8 degrees will be 1 in
> > 7!
> > > This is much too steep for independent access.
> > > In section (e) it refers to the ramp to the ground being 20 degrees
> > which
> > > translates into to approx. 1 in 2 which is nearly vertical and
> > impossible
> > > for access
> > I though that I was working it out incorrectly, as my geometry
> and
> > tan tables is not very good or maybe they had made a mistake typing
> > degrees instead of % , so I phoned the Department.
> > They assured me that it was degrees and that drivers could
> assist
> > if
> > the ramp was too steep.
> > I would not fancy pushing someone up a 1 in 2 slope. Would that
> be
> > a
> > manual handling situation?
> > So in reality we are not going to have accessible buses unless
> > there
> > is a high kerb. We will not be able to put high kerbs everywhere,
> > especially
> > on narrow roads on rural routes.
> > Surely they can design a more accessible bus? Are there more
> > accessible ones in other countries?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ******************************************************************
> >
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> > Mae'r e-bost hwn ac unrhyw ffeiliau a drosglwyddir gydag ef yn
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> >
> > ----------End of Message----------
> >
> > Run by SURFACE for more information on research, consultancy and the
> > distance taught MSc. in Accessibility and Inclusive Design programme
> > visit:
> >
> > http://www.inclusive-design.it
> >
> > Archives for the Accessibuilt discussion list are located at
> > http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/accessibuilt.html
> >
> > ----------End of Message----------
> >
> > Run by SURFACE for more information on research, consultancy and the
> > distance taught MSc. in Accessibility and Inclusive Design programme
> > visit:
> >
> > http://www.inclusive-design.it
> >
> > Archives for the Accessibuilt discussion list are located at
> > http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/accessibuilt.html
> >
> > ----------End of Message----------
> >
> > Run by SURFACE for more information on research, consultancy and the
> > distance taught MSc. in Accessibility and Inclusive Design programme
> > visit:
> >
> > http://www.inclusive-design.it
> >
> > Archives for the Accessibuilt discussion list are located at
> > http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/accessibuilt.html
> >
>
>
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> *******************************************************************
>
> ----------End of Message----------
>
> Run by SURFACE for more information on research, consultancy and the
> distance taught MSc. in Accessibility and Inclusive Design programme
> visit:
>
> http://www.inclusive-design.it
>
> Archives for the Accessibuilt discussion list are located at
> http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/accessibuilt.html
>
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Run by SURFACE for more information on research, consultancy and the distance taught MSc. in Accessibility and Inclusive Design programme visit:
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