I agree Fiona, it's appalling that experienced autonomous practitioners such
as yourself are earning less than my first year SHOs. And yes, regardless of
comparisons, you won't get very far with 33K these days, at least not in the
south-east. Someone on the list recently said (Simon Carley I think) that
some trusts just give their NCCGs (can I use that term anymore?) "banding"
so that their salary comes out at 40 to 50K. That's more like it, if you ask
me. Also the colleges have got to start recognising the experience of NCCGs
so that they can more easily transfer to a training grade if they so wish,
with the prospect of accelerated higher specialist training once they move.
Andrew Foster is pushing for this, but the colleges are dragging their
heels.
Adrian Fogarty
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fiona Wallace" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 9:06 PM
Subject: Re: Trick & Teat is Dead
It's all very wellbemoaning this rate of pay or that rate...but when you're
a staff grade you're looking at roughly the same rate ie £33K for the
forseeable future. No fun when house prices average £180K.
I am, quite seriously, beginning to panic about how I will survive
financially. The tiniest rental house costs over a third of my monthly take
home pay. My G reg car won't go on for ever (OK, it's a volvo, but even
so...). Council tax is likely to top £250 a month soon. And so it goes on,
only the salary doesn't change.
I'm not temperamentally suited to being a consultant. And I'm not after
that level of pay.
I want to live, not exist. I didn't spend five years at uni and over a
decade acquiring skills in order to lie awake worrying about money.
Fiona.
>We should not blame AH or anyone else for getting a good deal for junior
>docs. If anything it sets a benchmark for other grades. I think Nizam is
>now
>involved in the consultant deal which is good, was he not known as BFN
(o>r
>something like that - best ******* negotiator - at the time?).
>
>I have to say that I am not looking forward to a significant pay cut when>
I
>become a consultant later this year (if I get a job that is -
economicall>y
>it would be better to take a 2A clinical fellow post somewhere that is
pa>id
>the same as the SpRs!!!).
>
>Simon
>
>Simon & Fiona Carley
>[log in to unmask]
>http://www.bestbets.org
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Adrian Fogarty" <[log in to unmask]>
>To: <[log in to unmask]>
>Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 1:15 AM
>Subject: Re: Trick & Teat is Dead
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Simon Odum"
>Subject: Re: Trick & Teat is Dead
>
>> I'm new to the site but I must agree with Danny. All of our Staff
Grade>s
>are
>> excellent and hard working, and are all earning significantly LESS than
>our
>> SHO's. I think that some seroius thinking needs to be done if we are to
>> attract more high quality Staff Grades.
>> Agree that AH DOES have a lot to answer for!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
>Hold on a minute, why is everyone suddenly criticising AH? He did a damn
>good job for the juniors, and just 'cause the seniors and the career
grad>es
>haven't got their house in order, is no reason to criticise his work.
>Admittedly the banding system is irritating in its construct; I imagine
w>e'd
>all have preferred to continue with ADHs but with enhanced rates. The
>banding system was intended to be of a punitive/deterrent nature.
>Unfortunately it's "backfired" a little as most juniors are still working
>long hours, they're just getting paid ridiculous sums now which causes
>resentment elsewhere. Or else those who have reduced their hours have
onl>y
>done so at the expense of a sensible rota, i.e. now working split
weekend>s
>or partial shifts or the like.
>
>The remuneration loading is supposed to be prohibitive but it just causes
>huge anomalies. For example, my SHOs work approximately 20% over standard
>hours (48hrs v 40hrs) yet they receive an 80% enhancement in pay (band
2A>)!
>Similarly there are many who work 10% over standard hours (44hrs v 40hrs)
>yet they receive a 50% enhancement in total pay! Basically this amounts
t>o
>quadruple time or "time by 5" for on call work respectively! I'm on the
>doctors' side yet even I think this is ridiculous!
>
>This simply puts these inexperienced and relatively pampered first years
>into the £40K+ bracket. This causes endless resentment among other grad>es
>who are more experienced, yet who only manage to earn in the low to mid
>£30Ks for the same amount of work but with higher levels of
responsibil>ity.
>And we wonder why we have a recruitment crisis among non-consultant
caree>r
>grades these days!
>
>But I'm still not sure we should somehow "blame" AH for this problem. But
>then again, maybe the Government were stung so badly by this, rather
>perfidious, deal, that they're now anxious not to get bruised again, and
>are
>putting up a real fight with the seniors. That's very sad really, and
>perhaps a touch short-sighted, especially when you consider that we are
>juniors for a very short time in the overall scheme of things. And those
>very juniors who won this particular battle are already now dug into the
>trenches of the seniors' war, where they'll be holed up for a lot
longer.>..
>
>Adrian Fogarty
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